1 00:00:22,609 --> 00:00:09,090 welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast 2 00:00:31,740 --> 00:00:25,290 yes it's the skeptics are an episode 3 00:00:38,850 --> 00:00:31,750 number 141 for the first of July 2011 4 00:00:41,250 --> 00:00:38,860 july july are tam month damn mother two 5 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:41,260 short weeks and i'll be on that plane 6 00:00:48,829 --> 00:00:45,850 heading for Las Vegas I can't wait my 7 00:00:53,849 --> 00:00:48,839 calendar is being ticked off as I speak 8 00:00:56,340 --> 00:00:53,859 but today for the skeptic zone we have 9 00:00:59,130 --> 00:00:56,350 an interview with John rail from Los 10 00:01:02,669 --> 00:00:59,140 Angeles John is one of the people behind 11 00:01:05,850 --> 00:01:02,679 the new group for new ish skeptically 12 00:01:08,460 --> 00:01:05,860 pwned you've probably heard the the ads 13 00:01:11,310 --> 00:01:08,470 on the skeptic zone I met John I think 14 00:01:14,580 --> 00:01:11,320 about a year ago in California and he 15 00:01:16,020 --> 00:01:14,590 kicked me or I kicked him or I can't 16 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:16,030 remember but I'm sure we'll find out 17 00:01:19,730 --> 00:01:17,770 soon when I interviewed John all about 18 00:01:23,910 --> 00:01:19,740 his new project which is doing 19 00:01:25,530 --> 00:01:23,920 skeptically pwned videos and more that 20 00:01:28,470 --> 00:01:25,540 interview coming up at the top of the 21 00:01:31,020 --> 00:01:28,480 show and that will be followed by a 22 00:01:33,690 --> 00:01:31,030 think tank yes oh I love doing a think 23 00:01:35,820 --> 00:01:33,700 tank dr. Reggie and Joe and Benham who 24 00:01:37,890 --> 00:01:35,830 came along the other day the other night 25 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:37,900 for a nice Chinese dinner a couple of 26 00:01:42,780 --> 00:01:41,290 drinks diet coke of course well we 27 00:01:47,370 --> 00:01:42,790 should go back to champaign maybe I 28 00:01:50,100 --> 00:01:47,380 don't know hmm anyway and we had a nice 29 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:50,110 long chat and this time we actually 30 00:01:55,650 --> 00:01:53,410 cover quite a few our listener emails 31 00:01:58,200 --> 00:01:55,660 you know people write in to us about 32 00:01:59,910 --> 00:01:58,210 questions or points of view so we're 33 00:02:01,860 --> 00:01:59,920 going to cover some of those today in 34 00:02:04,530 --> 00:02:01,870 the think tank and a big thank you to 35 00:02:06,060 --> 00:02:04,540 some skeptics own friends and fans who 36 00:02:08,759 --> 00:02:06,070 have been coming along to be part of the 37 00:02:11,699 --> 00:02:08,769 studio audience for the filming of the 38 00:02:14,369 --> 00:02:11,709 television series the one which I take 39 00:02:15,900 --> 00:02:14,379 part in I'm not sure when that's going 40 00:02:17,970 --> 00:02:15,910 to be broadcast but we're filming at the 41 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:17,980 moment great fun to be there in the 42 00:02:24,959 --> 00:02:22,170 studio and good to see some skeptics are 43 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:24,969 well holding the fort there in the 44 00:02:28,330 --> 00:02:26,690 audience which is a 45 00:02:30,340 --> 00:02:28,340 seems to me mostly believe is but there 46 00:02:32,740 --> 00:02:30,350 you go and don't worry I'll be telling 47 00:02:35,530 --> 00:02:32,750 everybody as soon as I know when that 48 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:35,540 shows likely to be broadcast so you can 49 00:02:40,780 --> 00:02:38,330 tune in and have a laugh at me sitting 50 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:40,790 up there well today is a bit of a nippy 51 00:02:44,770 --> 00:02:42,770 day here in Sydney a bit chilly so I 52 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:44,780 think it's time to rush downstairs get 53 00:02:51,340 --> 00:02:46,850 some hot chocolate bung it in the 54 00:03:09,930 --> 00:02:51,350 microwave for about a minute enjoy that 55 00:03:17,380 --> 00:03:12,729 now folks I wonder if you've ever been 56 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:17,390 moon pound pound pound sent up caught 57 00:03:22,390 --> 00:03:19,970 out made a fool out of words to that 58 00:03:24,460 --> 00:03:22,400 effect I've been skeptically pwned a few 59 00:03:26,380 --> 00:03:24,470 times and I'm glad to say that I've got 60 00:03:29,289 --> 00:03:26,390 one of the greatest skeptical ponies out 61 00:03:31,869 --> 00:03:29,299 there John rail from Los Angeles hi John 62 00:03:35,319 --> 00:03:31,879 Hay has it gone Richard I'm doing really 63 00:03:36,910 --> 00:03:35,329 well now I met you I think it must have 64 00:03:38,470 --> 00:03:36,920 been last year or early this year or 65 00:03:41,170 --> 00:03:38,480 somewhere in the midst of time I can't 66 00:03:44,199 --> 00:03:41,180 remember yeah what's around a year ago 67 00:03:47,410 --> 00:03:44,209 that's right at a nice beach party that 68 00:03:49,900 --> 00:03:47,420 the brian dunning orange county and if 69 00:03:52,180 --> 00:03:49,910 anybody from la knows i drove all the 70 00:03:53,470 --> 00:03:52,190 way to Orange County to see you just 71 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:53,480 because I think you're coming all the 72 00:03:57,339 --> 00:03:55,370 way from Australia I can make that 73 00:04:00,039 --> 00:03:57,349 treacherous journey I remember that well 74 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:00,049 because dr. Reggie and I were fresh off 75 00:04:06,610 --> 00:04:03,410 the plane that day from Australia and in 76 00:04:09,580 --> 00:04:06,620 there we were next thing we know it's 77 00:04:12,430 --> 00:04:09,590 some beach party in the Orange County 78 00:04:14,500 --> 00:04:12,440 and having a great time and that yeah 79 00:04:16,060 --> 00:04:14,510 that's where i met you of course and i 80 00:04:19,210 --> 00:04:16,070 are with the dining in our pod with the 81 00:04:21,190 --> 00:04:19,220 darling and I'm so interested to find 82 00:04:23,830 --> 00:04:21,200 out more because I do play your ads on 83 00:04:26,620 --> 00:04:23,840 the skeptic zone this is where yeah we 84 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:26,630 appreciate it skeptically boned where 85 00:04:32,219 --> 00:04:29,570 was it where um you false claims get 86 00:04:34,510 --> 00:04:32,229 katadyn else gets kicked in the nuts um 87 00:04:36,370 --> 00:04:34,520 and I think it's a photograph of you 88 00:04:39,360 --> 00:04:36,380 kicking me or me kicking you I can't 89 00:04:42,969 --> 00:04:39,370 remember you're kicking me actually yeah 90 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:42,979 that's right now what what why don't you 91 00:04:46,719 --> 00:04:44,690 tell us a little bit about why you put 92 00:04:48,490 --> 00:04:46,729 this interesting group together and 93 00:04:50,770 --> 00:04:48,500 what's your take why have you gone down 94 00:04:53,379 --> 00:04:50,780 this angle well you know I mean we all 95 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:53,389 have something to contribute and frankly 96 00:04:58,210 --> 00:04:55,849 I'm not a scientist and decided I never 97 00:05:00,159 --> 00:04:58,220 will be but I dig the scientific method 98 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:00,169 and I want to promote it in some way and 99 00:05:06,430 --> 00:05:01,849 I've always been a comedian slash actor 100 00:05:09,610 --> 00:05:06,440 / writer so I it was actually around the 101 00:05:12,700 --> 00:05:09,620 the election the the 2004 Obama election 102 00:05:14,530 --> 00:05:12,710 I made a mini documentary where I gave 103 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:14,540 my vote away 104 00:05:19,150 --> 00:05:16,490 and because you can actually do that you 105 00:05:21,580 --> 00:05:19,160 can sign in a voter assistant and I did 106 00:05:23,830 --> 00:05:21,590 that and I gave my vote away and I made 107 00:05:25,990 --> 00:05:23,840 a little mini documentary about it and 108 00:05:28,180 --> 00:05:26,000 Penn Jillette saw it and Penn Jillette 109 00:05:31,470 --> 00:05:28,190 talked about it and I was like holy 110 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:31,480 I got to do more of this and yeah then I 111 00:05:37,810 --> 00:05:35,090 just decided to make sketch comedy for 112 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:37,820 the skeptics and that has led you now I 113 00:05:43,270 --> 00:05:40,970 mean apart from sounding making wacky 114 00:05:46,540 --> 00:05:43,280 ads for the skeptic zone you that led 115 00:05:48,010 --> 00:05:46,550 you to get really into video production 116 00:05:49,750 --> 00:05:48,020 I've had a sneak peek of one of the 117 00:05:51,790 --> 00:05:49,760 videos you're putting together that 118 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:51,800 looks really funny and I'm really 119 00:05:55,230 --> 00:05:53,210 jealous i want to fly straight over 120 00:05:58,390 --> 00:05:55,240 there now in appear in your next video 121 00:06:01,690 --> 00:05:58,400 dude did that would be amazing that 122 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:01,700 would ya know we've we've kind of gotten 123 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:04,730 good at making short movies as it work 124 00:06:08,980 --> 00:06:06,890 is yes seriously at the beginning you 125 00:06:11,170 --> 00:06:08,990 know we were just monkeys with a camera 126 00:06:13,810 --> 00:06:11,180 and we had some friends who had a little 127 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:13,820 technical expertise and they helped us 128 00:06:18,610 --> 00:06:16,010 in post-production and we've just you 129 00:06:21,100 --> 00:06:18,620 know been increasing and adding to our 130 00:06:23,260 --> 00:06:21,110 Arsenal's of arsenal of skills ever 131 00:06:25,270 --> 00:06:23,270 since I think you'll notice in this 132 00:06:28,510 --> 00:06:25,280 recent one there's some cool animation 133 00:06:30,100 --> 00:06:28,520 and who's really the creative force 134 00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:30,110 behind that would you say yourself or 135 00:06:36,760 --> 00:06:32,930 you sort of bounce off other people uh 136 00:06:40,510 --> 00:06:36,770 yes I'm the main force behind it but I 137 00:06:44,260 --> 00:06:40,520 find other people to use for my purposes 138 00:06:46,500 --> 00:06:44,270 um so I I do most of the writing I do 139 00:06:49,990 --> 00:06:46,510 most of the directing most of the 140 00:06:53,410 --> 00:06:50,000 cinematography but then you know like my 141 00:06:57,340 --> 00:06:53,420 my animator / girlfriend will come in 142 00:06:59,680 --> 00:06:57,350 and make amazing art and animation for 143 00:07:02,830 --> 00:06:59,690 the videos and then I'll get you know 144 00:07:04,150 --> 00:07:02,840 some feedback from other editors and you 145 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:04,160 know ask people what kind of software 146 00:07:08,530 --> 00:07:06,410 can do this and because you know I 147 00:07:11,230 --> 00:07:08,540 didn't go to film school I'm not a you 148 00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:11,240 know I'm not a film student but i know 149 00:07:15,340 --> 00:07:13,130 enough film makers out there where I can 150 00:07:16,780 --> 00:07:15,350 you know ask them in layman's term well 151 00:07:18,270 --> 00:07:16,790 how do I do this and they're like oh go 152 00:07:22,330 --> 00:07:18,280 get this software and I'm like awesome 153 00:07:24,190 --> 00:07:22,340 so it's it's free for everybody now you 154 00:07:26,500 --> 00:07:24,200 know we can all living in Los Angeles 155 00:07:27,460 --> 00:07:26,510 you probably go to a few people there 156 00:07:32,890 --> 00:07:27,470 you can 157 00:07:34,390 --> 00:07:32,900 video production yes a ton so I I you 158 00:07:37,330 --> 00:07:34,400 know like most of the artistic 159 00:07:40,570 --> 00:07:37,340 inspiration is mine but it's through a 160 00:07:42,490 --> 00:07:40,580 lot of other people's help yes I've had 161 00:07:44,380 --> 00:07:42,500 a sneak peek of one of the videos and 162 00:07:47,380 --> 00:07:44,390 this one was dealing with martial arts 163 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:47,390 and I understand that everybody can see 164 00:07:54,220 --> 00:07:49,490 that probably about the time the show 165 00:07:56,110 --> 00:07:54,230 goes out right about now yes that was 166 00:07:57,520 --> 00:07:56,120 that was enormous fun i was laughing so 167 00:07:59,020 --> 00:07:57,530 much when i was watching that what can 168 00:08:00,850 --> 00:07:59,030 you tell me about the making of that and 169 00:08:05,110 --> 00:08:00,860 why did you choose that topic and and 170 00:08:07,500 --> 00:08:05,120 and who is the girl um v girl the the 171 00:08:13,060 --> 00:08:07,510 kick-ass girl was actually my girlfriend 172 00:08:17,020 --> 00:08:13,070 / animator / kung fu fighter and the guy 173 00:08:19,090 --> 00:08:17,030 who I found he was also incredible he he 174 00:08:21,270 --> 00:08:19,100 i went to college with him and he was on 175 00:08:25,180 --> 00:08:21,280 tour with walking with the dinosaurs 176 00:08:28,650 --> 00:08:25,190 well which it was this huge live 177 00:08:31,780 --> 00:08:28,660 production of that BBC documentary cgi 178 00:08:34,990 --> 00:08:31,790 United work program that to Australia to 179 00:08:37,810 --> 00:08:35,000 oh nice well he was the guy inside the 180 00:08:41,469 --> 00:08:37,820 Raptor yeah you know really physically 181 00:08:43,060 --> 00:08:41,479 built as you can tell yeah and yeah so 182 00:08:44,680 --> 00:08:43,070 that's who they were and they just you 183 00:08:47,170 --> 00:08:44,690 know he happened to be in town when I 184 00:08:50,020 --> 00:08:47,180 wanted to shoot it and so that's how we 185 00:08:53,710 --> 00:08:50,030 did it and I did I did all the 186 00:08:56,740 --> 00:08:53,720 choreography but he was able to pull it 187 00:08:57,940 --> 00:08:56,750 off yeah you know like I had ideas I 188 00:09:00,250 --> 00:08:57,950 brought to the table I'm like are you 189 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:00,260 able to do this can you do that he's 190 00:09:04,300 --> 00:09:01,610 like yeah and then i'll throw in a 191 00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:04,310 spinning kick how am i oh nice perfect 192 00:09:10,270 --> 00:09:06,890 now i love it because it's concerning 193 00:09:13,570 --> 00:09:10,280 the the the great wacky topic of Bushido 194 00:09:18,220 --> 00:09:13,580 oh isn't it yes or as I like to 195 00:09:20,560 --> 00:09:18,230 call it tae kwon don't know why did you 196 00:09:22,750 --> 00:09:20,570 choose that topic exactly well that one 197 00:09:24,910 --> 00:09:22,760 uh just because well if if you're 198 00:09:28,210 --> 00:09:24,920 familiar at all with kung fu cinema 199 00:09:31,810 --> 00:09:28,220 there's just so much so much fertile 200 00:09:33,670 --> 00:09:31,820 ground for comedy and so I figured hey 201 00:09:36,850 --> 00:09:33,680 you know that that's the one we got to 202 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:36,860 go with well I think it worked very well 203 00:09:40,180 --> 00:09:38,330 because their sudden there's a great 204 00:09:40,660 --> 00:09:40,190 scope there for all sorts of things and 205 00:09:42,550 --> 00:09:40,670 they 206 00:09:44,410 --> 00:09:42,560 it's fantastic it's very exciting and 207 00:09:48,370 --> 00:09:44,420 it's very funny and of course there are 208 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:48,380 so many misconceptions and myths and 209 00:09:53,410 --> 00:09:50,810 mysticism wrapped up in martial arts 210 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:53,420 yeah and I think that's what inspired me 211 00:09:59,050 --> 00:09:56,650 most is I watched a few online videos 212 00:10:02,920 --> 00:09:59,060 actually I'll give credit where credit's 213 00:10:06,490 --> 00:10:02,930 due I listened to the sceptile hot cast 214 00:10:08,170 --> 00:10:06,500 about Baljeet oh haha am and I literally 215 00:10:09,820 --> 00:10:08,180 didn't believe what he was saying I 216 00:10:11,980 --> 00:10:09,830 literally you know I'm a skeptic of 217 00:10:14,020 --> 00:10:11,990 course I was like no way no way two 218 00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:14,030 people believe this nowadays you know 219 00:10:19,630 --> 00:10:16,850 2011 nobody believes that a force punch 220 00:10:21,460 --> 00:10:19,640 is real and you hit the YouTube and 221 00:10:25,270 --> 00:10:21,470 there are dozens of videos where people 222 00:10:27,730 --> 00:10:25,280 are you know using force punches and 223 00:10:31,630 --> 00:10:27,740 their opponents feel weekend and and 224 00:10:34,030 --> 00:10:31,640 hurt and injured and what the most 225 00:10:38,350 --> 00:10:34,040 inspiring video I saw for all this was 226 00:10:41,350 --> 00:10:38,360 this this TV series called martial arts 227 00:10:44,830 --> 00:10:41,360 miracles uh-huh and there's this clip 228 00:10:46,690 --> 00:10:44,840 out of it where this guy he actually he 229 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:46,700 does this ritual performs this huge 230 00:10:51,310 --> 00:10:48,650 involve like 20 minute ritual he's 231 00:10:53,890 --> 00:10:51,320 spitting everywhere he's wrapping his 232 00:10:57,160 --> 00:10:53,900 arm with psychic energy he pulls out a 233 00:11:00,070 --> 00:10:57,170 huge blade and chops his chops his arm 234 00:11:02,620 --> 00:11:00,080 that I've seen oh yes and I've seen it's 235 00:11:05,620 --> 00:11:02,630 horrible yeah and just yeah blood-red 236 00:11:06,790 --> 00:11:05,630 start rushing and the Hosen just looks 237 00:11:10,290 --> 00:11:06,800 at the camera like I don't know what to 238 00:11:13,870 --> 00:11:10,300 do but yeah call the paramedics yeah 239 00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:13,880 absolutely staggering he was so so 240 00:11:18,940 --> 00:11:16,610 convinced of his own special powers that 241 00:11:22,060 --> 00:11:18,950 he was he went to that length yeah he 242 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:22,070 went for it and so it was just shocking 243 00:11:29,830 --> 00:11:25,610 that somebody you know grown grown men 244 00:11:32,350 --> 00:11:29,840 who yeah potentially have lethal 245 00:11:34,780 --> 00:11:32,360 abilities yes believe in such craziness 246 00:11:37,330 --> 00:11:34,790 at least you did about himself another 247 00:11:39,730 --> 00:11:37,340 volunteer yeah you know I mean these 248 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:39,740 these aren't just these aren't just 249 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:41,330 regular believe is amol these are 250 00:11:45,340 --> 00:11:43,250 dangerous believers in yeah 251 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:45,350 absolutely it also reminds me of the 252 00:11:48,970 --> 00:11:46,970 video I saw of a group called yellow 253 00:11:52,060 --> 00:11:48,980 bamboo have you seen that one no I 254 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:52,070 haven't oh absolutely worth checking out 255 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:53,250 yellow bamboo where 256 00:11:58,460 --> 00:11:55,530 a martial arts group I think they were 257 00:12:00,830 --> 00:11:58,470 based in Indonesia from memory and they 258 00:12:04,100 --> 00:12:00,840 were challenged by other martial artists 259 00:12:06,470 --> 00:12:04,110 who said look if their claim was that 260 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:06,480 they could if someone was attacking them 261 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:08,850 they could just repel them with psychic 262 00:12:13,730 --> 00:12:11,450 force you know magic mystical mush lux 263 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:13,740 chi or whatever it was but is this 264 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:15,450 summary the old guy gets his ass handed 265 00:12:21,770 --> 00:12:19,890 to him ah well that does happen yes it's 266 00:12:23,810 --> 00:12:21,780 on a beach so they've come to some beach 267 00:12:25,820 --> 00:12:23,820 and these other guys just charged at 268 00:12:27,470 --> 00:12:25,830 them and completely bowled them over at 269 00:12:30,830 --> 00:12:27,480 her as you would say they were 270 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:30,840 absolutely pwned yellow bamboo worth 271 00:12:34,190 --> 00:12:32,370 checking out and listeners to if you 272 00:12:35,750 --> 00:12:34,200 just Google yellow bamboo and I think 273 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:35,760 there's a link from the skeptics 274 00:12:38,990 --> 00:12:37,530 dictionary for that one but I certainly 275 00:12:40,910 --> 00:12:39,000 worth checking out because it's a 276 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:40,920 real-life case of this sort of thing 277 00:12:45,050 --> 00:12:43,530 being put to the test no I actually saw 278 00:12:48,410 --> 00:12:45,060 the other one that Brian Dunning talked 279 00:12:49,940 --> 00:12:48,420 about the the old guy who had like I got 280 00:12:51,530 --> 00:12:49,950 three thousand dollar challenge that he 281 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:51,540 could not be beat because of his psychic 282 00:12:57,800 --> 00:12:54,210 energy and some mixed martial artist 283 00:12:59,630 --> 00:12:57,810 just beat the poor man silly you know 284 00:13:01,520 --> 00:12:59,640 like I didn't know effort yeah I mean at 285 00:13:03,590 --> 00:13:01,530 first it's funny the first 30 seconds 286 00:13:05,990 --> 00:13:03,600 you know it is hilarious but two minutes 287 00:13:07,430 --> 00:13:06,000 in after this old guys getting the crap 288 00:13:12,230 --> 00:13:07,440 kicked out of him by this young guy it's 289 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:12,240 very sad it is yeah it's funny I yeah I 290 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:14,490 can see exactly coming from its that 291 00:13:19,100 --> 00:13:17,250 there's a point where it's like you do 292 00:13:21,620 --> 00:13:19,110 you have to feel some empathy because 293 00:13:25,970 --> 00:13:21,630 someone's basically having their their 294 00:13:27,170 --> 00:13:25,980 worldview torn apart but you can be torn 295 00:13:30,590 --> 00:13:27,180 watching that sort of thing but I think 296 00:13:33,410 --> 00:13:30,600 I wasn't torn watching the yellow bamboo 297 00:13:35,270 --> 00:13:33,420 that's quite funny if if you check that 298 00:13:37,310 --> 00:13:35,280 one out now tell me about some of the 299 00:13:40,220 --> 00:13:37,320 local groups in your area that you're 300 00:13:42,620 --> 00:13:40,230 involved with okay um well because of 301 00:13:45,710 --> 00:13:42,630 this whole skeptic thing it's kind of 302 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:45,720 hard not to get involved and you know 303 00:13:51,020 --> 00:13:47,250 the first year I was doing my web series 304 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:51,030 I was just purely online purely armchair 305 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:53,250 skeptic not really getting in anywhere 306 00:13:58,760 --> 00:13:56,370 and then you know came the iig awards 307 00:14:00,320 --> 00:13:58,770 and drinking skeptically and all of a 308 00:14:04,310 --> 00:14:00,330 sudden I started meeting all these cool 309 00:14:07,070 --> 00:14:04,320 people who really you know not only were 310 00:14:10,220 --> 00:14:07,080 enthused but they were like they 311 00:14:11,870 --> 00:14:10,230 they wanted to utilize my skills and I'm 312 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:11,880 like what skills and they're like no no 313 00:14:16,550 --> 00:14:15,090 we could use a guy like you and and so 314 00:14:19,190 --> 00:14:16,560 because of that i became involved with 315 00:14:22,550 --> 00:14:19,200 the iig the independent investigations 316 00:14:25,930 --> 00:14:22,560 group arm otherwise known as the ghost 317 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:25,940 hunters who turn on the lights huh so 318 00:14:31,070 --> 00:14:28,650 like that yeah so I became involved with 319 00:14:34,340 --> 00:14:31,080 them because they were they had started 320 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:34,350 a media group to category you know 321 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:36,810 catalog all the cool experiments that 322 00:14:42,050 --> 00:14:39,450 they've been doing the last decade and I 323 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:42,060 said you know what we really need is a 324 00:14:47,830 --> 00:14:45,450 promo something that'll show you know 325 00:14:50,660 --> 00:14:47,840 how cool we are and what we do is 326 00:14:52,670 --> 00:14:50,670 innovative and so much different than 327 00:14:57,530 --> 00:14:52,680 all the other ghost hunters that are out 328 00:15:00,470 --> 00:14:57,540 there yeah and it is too and of course 329 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:00,480 the tag line in fact we come to think 330 00:15:10,430 --> 00:15:04,050 about it the the female voice we hear on 331 00:15:13,660 --> 00:15:10,440 your ad which is this one is that the 332 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:13,670 same girl who's in the is in the video 333 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:17,250 actually yes yes my girlfriend / 334 00:15:21,620 --> 00:15:19,170 animator Jenn brown by the way her name 335 00:15:24,620 --> 00:15:21,630 is Chen Brown she is the one who plays 336 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:24,630 the ghost but the but the cute little 337 00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:27,450 voice at the end that is a friend of 338 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:30,810 mine she's an actress Larissa McCoy and 339 00:15:35,900 --> 00:15:33,330 she perpetually sounds like she's 12 340 00:15:39,590 --> 00:15:35,910 years old so yeah I knew I had to use 341 00:15:42,290 --> 00:15:39,600 her for that voiceover you just 342 00:15:46,130 --> 00:15:42,300 surrounded by tellin ya it's insane and 343 00:15:48,230 --> 00:15:46,140 because of the iig this the promo I was 344 00:15:51,230 --> 00:15:48,240 doing was strictly at first just 345 00:15:53,450 --> 00:15:51,240 interviewing other iig members and you 346 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:53,460 know cutting up a cool promo slick promo 347 00:15:57,260 --> 00:15:55,170 which by the way will also be released 348 00:15:59,720 --> 00:15:57,270 very soon though not when there's 349 00:16:03,020 --> 00:15:59,730 podcasts airs but before tam will have 350 00:16:04,910 --> 00:16:03,030 it out there and it just kind of it kind 351 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:04,920 of grew and grew to the point where 352 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:06,810 every member was coming up to me and 353 00:16:09,980 --> 00:16:08,010 saying you know who you should interview 354 00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:09,990 next you should get Paul Provenza you 355 00:16:14,540 --> 00:16:11,370 should get em remember you you should 356 00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:14,550 get Brian Dalton and uh huh so soon i 357 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:16,170 just started interviewing all these 358 00:16:19,580 --> 00:16:17,970 people like not for the promo just you 359 00:16:20,690 --> 00:16:19,590 know get to know your local skeptic on 360 00:16:22,370 --> 00:16:20,700 high-def well I'm 361 00:16:25,850 --> 00:16:22,380 logo skeptic but I hope you get to know 362 00:16:28,670 --> 00:16:25,860 me I hope we can click a tan and you can 363 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:28,680 find a 10-minute period of time we're 364 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:30,570 not being rushed around or trying to 365 00:16:34,910 --> 00:16:33,090 sleep oath to recover from mine I will 366 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:34,920 no sleep desperately try to hunt you 367 00:16:39,980 --> 00:16:38,250 down and it's going to be fun it's going 368 00:16:42,260 --> 00:16:39,990 to be fun in fact if anybody sees me at 369 00:16:44,180 --> 00:16:42,270 em please bring me a coffee in one hand 370 00:16:45,530 --> 00:16:44,190 extend your hand to greet me in the 371 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:45,540 other hand have a coffee ready because 372 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:47,370 i'm going to be whack out of my head but 373 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:49,410 I will make time John we will get 374 00:16:53,330 --> 00:16:51,330 together I love what you're doing now 375 00:16:55,610 --> 00:16:53,340 where can people go to check out the 376 00:16:58,610 --> 00:16:55,620 video and more people can go well okay 377 00:17:00,650 --> 00:16:58,620 web two point oh um I wouldn't even say 378 00:17:04,250 --> 00:17:00,660 go to skeptically palm com I'd say go to 379 00:17:05,810 --> 00:17:04,260 youtube.com slash skeptically pwned but 380 00:17:07,370 --> 00:17:05,820 if you want if you want the cool flash 381 00:17:10,550 --> 00:17:07,380 the cool you know look that we're going 382 00:17:12,550 --> 00:17:10,560 for go to skeptically palm com which 383 00:17:16,490 --> 00:17:12,560 will inevitably take you to youtube.com 384 00:17:18,470 --> 00:17:16,500 slash skeptically pound you know it's a 385 00:17:21,170 --> 00:17:18,480 way or another that's such a strange 386 00:17:23,150 --> 00:17:21,180 beast these days like like our own 387 00:17:25,579 --> 00:17:23,160 individual websites have become so 388 00:17:28,340 --> 00:17:25,589 personal like I can't remember the last 389 00:17:29,930 --> 00:17:28,350 time I actually went to you know I'm 390 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:29,940 trying to think of a website i went to 391 00:17:33,740 --> 00:17:31,650 like an individual website because i 392 00:17:36,590 --> 00:17:33,750 always go to you know the third party 393 00:17:38,030 --> 00:17:36,600 websites the youtubers book I don't know 394 00:17:39,710 --> 00:17:38,040 how you find the time and I've also 395 00:17:42,950 --> 00:17:39,720 learned that you've got some very 396 00:17:46,220 --> 00:17:42,960 exciting guests coming up I do i do some 397 00:17:50,090 --> 00:17:46,230 that were very very desperately fought 398 00:17:53,540 --> 00:17:50,100 for i have upcoming interviews with tim 399 00:17:56,300 --> 00:17:53,550 minchin active mention oh the australian 400 00:17:58,250 --> 00:17:56,310 entertainer skeptical singer polka who 401 00:17:59,900 --> 00:17:58,260 by the way you guys all know and he's 402 00:18:01,760 --> 00:17:59,910 this international star and i've seen 403 00:18:04,970 --> 00:18:01,770 all his work and I love him to death I 404 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:04,980 try and brag to my friends at work or 405 00:18:08,050 --> 00:18:06,330 something on my dude I'm I'm 406 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:08,060 interviewing Tim mentioned I like who 407 00:18:13,130 --> 00:18:10,890 I'm like yeah like the man's an 408 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:13,140 international celebrity and I can't 409 00:18:18,740 --> 00:18:14,970 really you know bragged anybody except 410 00:18:20,810 --> 00:18:18,750 my fellow skeptics but that one yeah he 411 00:18:22,210 --> 00:18:20,820 was really nice about it I sent in I 412 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:22,220 actually made him a full video 413 00:18:27,470 --> 00:18:25,290 requesting his interview and he emailed 414 00:18:28,820 --> 00:18:27,480 me back he's like love the video I'd you 415 00:18:31,190 --> 00:18:28,830 know be more than happy to give you some 416 00:18:33,710 --> 00:18:31,200 of my time while I'm in LA so so that 417 00:18:34,460 --> 00:18:33,720 was great and i also have bill nye 418 00:18:37,220 --> 00:18:34,470 coming up 419 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:37,230 now bill now Bill Nye affiliate for our 420 00:18:41,270 --> 00:18:39,090 American business is very well known but 421 00:18:43,580 --> 00:18:41,280 for our international this is and the 422 00:18:47,090 --> 00:18:43,590 Australian listeners to who is Bill Nye 423 00:18:50,180 --> 00:18:47,100 exact Bill Nye is the science guy he 424 00:18:54,710 --> 00:18:50,190 yeah like way back in the day just like 425 00:18:57,260 --> 00:18:54,720 mr. wizard he Purdue oil him and Disney 426 00:18:59,560 --> 00:18:57,270 produced a hundred episodes on every 427 00:19:02,510 --> 00:18:59,570 scientific topic you can think of and 428 00:19:04,730 --> 00:19:02,520 just made this really cool show called 429 00:19:06,380 --> 00:19:04,740 bill nye the science guy just you know 430 00:19:09,230 --> 00:19:06,390 explaining every week a brand new 431 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:09,240 scientific topic and you know if you're 432 00:19:13,190 --> 00:19:11,610 from America especially you know he 433 00:19:16,279 --> 00:19:13,200 lives in your psyche there is not a 434 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:16,289 there's not a kid you know above the age 435 00:19:22,070 --> 00:19:18,450 of twenty that does not know who Bill 436 00:19:23,750 --> 00:19:22,080 nya's wow that's a big that's a big 437 00:19:26,990 --> 00:19:23,760 school that and you get a lot of people 438 00:19:28,700 --> 00:19:27,000 who have be very unhappy I guess for 439 00:19:30,740 --> 00:19:28,710 nostalgic reasons to that you have built 440 00:19:34,100 --> 00:19:30,750 yeah and also not to mention that he's 441 00:19:37,100 --> 00:19:34,110 going to be at am nine this year well 442 00:19:39,620 --> 00:19:37,110 there you go another tam time yeah so 443 00:19:41,930 --> 00:19:39,630 I'm very excited we're doing a lot of 444 00:19:44,510 --> 00:19:41,940 work and we got a few upcoming episodes 445 00:19:47,360 --> 00:19:44,520 of skeptically pone but always feel free 446 00:19:49,190 --> 00:19:47,370 to email me I'm readily available and 447 00:19:52,549 --> 00:19:49,200 give me any suggestions you guys might 448 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:52,559 have check it out everybody have a look 449 00:19:57,230 --> 00:19:54,570 at the video it's fantastic the website 450 00:20:00,230 --> 00:19:57,240 skeptically pwned that newfangled 451 00:20:02,990 --> 00:20:00,240 internet word John rail pleasure to chat 452 00:20:05,390 --> 00:20:03,000 with you and I look forward to having a 453 00:20:07,070 --> 00:20:05,400 coffee with you in a few short weeks at 454 00:20:09,980 --> 00:20:07,080 ten thank you very much richer but I'm 455 00:20:21,210 --> 00:20:09,990 going to be drinking diet coke I don't 456 00:20:26,830 --> 00:20:24,159 hi this is brian dunning from skep tide 457 00:20:28,810 --> 00:20:26,840 calm the best way to share the benefits 458 00:20:30,490 --> 00:20:28,820 of critical thinking and science with 459 00:20:33,460 --> 00:20:30,500 someone who doesn't listen to podcasts 460 00:20:35,470 --> 00:20:33,470 is to give them a book I invite you to 461 00:20:37,810 --> 00:20:35,480 check out my newest book based on 462 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:37,820 selected episodes of The sceptile cast 463 00:20:44,710 --> 00:20:41,210 skep tied three pirates pyramids and 464 00:20:47,019 --> 00:20:44,720 papyrus 50 chapters contain something 465 00:20:49,450 --> 00:20:47,029 for everyone questions you've always 466 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:49,460 wondered about and subject to intrigue 467 00:20:55,299 --> 00:20:52,610 and challenge your friends pirates 468 00:20:57,610 --> 00:20:55,309 pyramids and papyrus by Brian Dunning 469 00:20:59,740 --> 00:20:57,620 with a foreword by Richard Saunders of 470 00:21:02,259 --> 00:20:59,750 the Australian skeptics it's available 471 00:21:05,769 --> 00:21:02,269 now from major online booksellers as a 472 00:21:08,850 --> 00:21:05,779 paperback and as an e-book or get a 473 00:21:15,460 --> 00:21:08,860 personalized copy from sceptile calm I'm 474 00:21:18,460 --> 00:21:15,470 Brian Dunning from skep tide calm join 475 00:21:26,310 --> 00:21:18,470 us now for drinking skeptically in the 476 00:21:37,630 --> 00:21:35,200 that is newcastle dr h e and Joe Benna 477 00:21:39,730 --> 00:21:37,640 mu are talking about drinks what's this 478 00:21:43,630 --> 00:21:39,740 lovely family pictures I know that's not 479 00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:43,640 what I was meant to be sure she still we 480 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:45,290 seem to be starting every episode of the 481 00:21:48,670 --> 00:21:46,970 tank that I'm on these days by me 482 00:21:51,340 --> 00:21:48,680 embarrassing myself in one way or 483 00:21:53,620 --> 00:21:51,350 another Oh Joe we do understand but 484 00:21:58,320 --> 00:21:53,630 welcome dr. Aegean welcome Joe and Ben 485 00:22:02,680 --> 00:21:58,330 amoud to the think tank cheers Cheers 486 00:22:04,510 --> 00:22:02,690 back legs around it mm-hmm it is tonight 487 00:22:06,310 --> 00:22:04,520 it makes for clearer thinking then all 488 00:22:08,380 --> 00:22:06,320 that champagne we used to drink I think 489 00:22:09,790 --> 00:22:08,390 and it's great to be back in our 490 00:22:13,030 --> 00:22:09,800 favorite club down the end of the street 491 00:22:14,170 --> 00:22:13,040 which isn't too busy tonight it isn't 492 00:22:16,090 --> 00:22:14,180 too busy and we've all had a nice 493 00:22:19,110 --> 00:22:16,100 Chinese nom in fact you didn't even 494 00:22:22,090 --> 00:22:19,120 finish yours joke normal fail yeah 495 00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:22,100 nothing valdisa nomming fair it isn't on 496 00:22:29,380 --> 00:22:27,050 the ground very nice to see dr. AG back 497 00:22:31,180 --> 00:22:29,390 in town and you were just are visiting 498 00:22:33,790 --> 00:22:31,190 our friends in Melbourne dr. AG how did 499 00:22:35,980 --> 00:22:33,800 that go really really well I did a talk 500 00:22:38,470 --> 00:22:35,990 for Victorian skeptics and talk for 501 00:22:40,450 --> 00:22:38,480 Melbourne skeptics there's no 12 groups 502 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:40,460 in Victoria skeptical groups in 503 00:22:47,740 --> 00:22:43,970 Victorian so um yeah there was no it was 504 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:47,750 fantastic it was I had a great time game 505 00:22:52,120 --> 00:22:49,490 half the talks and met lots of people 506 00:22:55,510 --> 00:22:52,130 who I hadn't met before yeah what why 507 00:22:57,490 --> 00:22:55,520 what were your talks oh it was really 508 00:23:01,120 --> 00:22:57,500 just a summary of dr. retching reports 509 00:23:06,310 --> 00:23:01,130 with some a little bit of stuff about 510 00:23:08,650 --> 00:23:06,320 dr. google also hair analysis oh yeah 511 00:23:12,580 --> 00:23:08,660 how to spot a scam how sort of what red 512 00:23:14,230 --> 00:23:12,590 flags you should look for and yeah some 513 00:23:16,210 --> 00:23:14,240 of the sort of investigations I've done 514 00:23:18,610 --> 00:23:16,220 over the years all right so was good I 515 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:18,620 noticed people with little live tweeting 516 00:23:22,660 --> 00:23:20,570 Europe talks Lucas Randall with life's 517 00:23:24,820 --> 00:23:22,670 waiting here a lot of Monday nights yeah 518 00:23:27,940 --> 00:23:24,830 yeah it was hashtag rachy branch 519 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:27,950 actually it was and it's interesting you 520 00:23:31,150 --> 00:23:29,330 should say hair analysis because I 521 00:23:32,950 --> 00:23:31,160 noticed that choice magazine 522 00:23:36,450 --> 00:23:32,960 report if you've caught up with that 523 00:23:39,700 --> 00:23:36,460 it's on their website about doji 524 00:23:40,870 --> 00:23:39,710 diagnostic I think someone is also 525 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:40,880 wanted poster that should I haven't had 526 00:23:44,500 --> 00:23:42,170 a chance to look at it though yeah well 527 00:23:46,810 --> 00:23:44,510 worth what looking at listeners if you 528 00:23:49,180 --> 00:23:46,820 go to the website of choice magazine 529 00:23:52,060 --> 00:23:49,190 which is I think it's choice Khamenei 530 00:23:53,470 --> 00:23:52,070 you a brilliant magazine consumer 531 00:23:56,700 --> 00:23:53,480 watchdog good friends of ours but 532 00:23:59,890 --> 00:23:56,710 they've got a story up there about dodgy 533 00:24:03,040 --> 00:23:59,900 diagnostics including iridology live 534 00:24:05,950 --> 00:24:03,050 blood analysis hair analysis so worth 535 00:24:08,140 --> 00:24:05,960 checking out indeed and reaching you're 536 00:24:10,450 --> 00:24:08,150 still getting great coverage from an 537 00:24:12,190 --> 00:24:10,460 article you wrote a little while ago for 538 00:24:14,170 --> 00:24:12,200 cosmos magazine talking about magazines 539 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:14,180 yeah cosmos sent out a press release 540 00:24:18,490 --> 00:24:16,010 about my opinion piece which was 541 00:24:21,430 --> 00:24:18,500 essentially about the NHMRC draft 542 00:24:23,980 --> 00:24:21,440 statement about homeopathy where they 543 00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:23,990 say that they want to make an official 544 00:24:30,250 --> 00:24:26,210 position which is that homeopathy is 545 00:24:32,710 --> 00:24:30,260 unethical and not efficacious yep I've 546 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:32,720 done a three interviews now all with the 547 00:24:37,120 --> 00:24:35,450 ABC I did one today which was a pre 548 00:24:39,370 --> 00:24:37,130 record which is going to run tomorrow 549 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:39,380 which will be two days ago to listeners 550 00:24:43,750 --> 00:24:42,050 anyway I'm going to try and grab a grab 551 00:24:45,130 --> 00:24:43,760 that and so I can get it up because it 552 00:24:46,900 --> 00:24:45,140 was really good today yeah if we can 553 00:24:48,910 --> 00:24:46,910 grab that will certainly play it on on 554 00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:48,920 the zone in an upcoming episode Yale 555 00:24:53,050 --> 00:24:51,290 yeah well actually somebody um I can't 556 00:24:56,890 --> 00:24:53,060 really can't remember her name i think 557 00:24:58,840 --> 00:24:56,900 it's Lori she sent me an email saying 558 00:25:00,400 --> 00:24:58,850 that and this is something I've been 559 00:25:02,140 --> 00:25:00,410 thinking about to but I hadn't had time 560 00:25:04,270 --> 00:25:02,150 to chase it up if its draft statement 561 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:04,280 and they're going to consult consumers 562 00:25:10,210 --> 00:25:08,090 as they say there was nothing really on 563 00:25:12,910 --> 00:25:10,220 there in contained in that statement 564 00:25:14,470 --> 00:25:12,920 about how to go about you know 565 00:25:18,430 --> 00:25:14,480 submitting a comment if you wanted to 566 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:18,440 comment yeah I think Lori apologize if 567 00:25:21,790 --> 00:25:19,970 I've got your name wrong I don't have my 568 00:25:25,030 --> 00:25:21,800 emails in front of me she actually 569 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:25,040 called up the NHMRC and asked them how 570 00:25:29,230 --> 00:25:26,810 the public could go about submitting 571 00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:29,240 comment about this statement and 572 00:25:33,490 --> 00:25:31,730 apparently she was told that at the 573 00:25:35,350 --> 00:25:33,500 moment the NHMRC are taking submissions 574 00:25:37,630 --> 00:25:35,360 from the homeopath 575 00:25:39,250 --> 00:25:37,640 and once the committee has assessed the 576 00:25:41,070 --> 00:25:39,260 opinions of the homeopath they'll then 577 00:25:44,950 --> 00:25:41,080 ask other people further down the track 578 00:25:46,210 --> 00:25:44,960 to also submit comment it's just a 579 00:25:47,770 --> 00:25:46,220 little bit odd to me because i would 580 00:25:49,750 --> 00:25:47,780 have presumed if you're going to open up 581 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:49,760 something for public comment you'd open 582 00:25:53,500 --> 00:25:51,650 it up for public comment not while I'm 583 00:25:55,450 --> 00:25:53,510 waiting for the homeopath solid it's a 584 00:25:56,980 --> 00:25:55,460 lot then to the public then to the 585 00:25:59,770 --> 00:25:56,990 doctors or whatever unless they're 586 00:26:01,270 --> 00:25:59,780 literally expecting everyone to submit 587 00:26:02,890 --> 00:26:01,280 me things are gonna get a flood of mail 588 00:26:06,100 --> 00:26:02,900 but they just won't know what to do with 589 00:26:07,750 --> 00:26:06,110 well I'm gonna be opposed to go you know 590 00:26:10,270 --> 00:26:07,760 I know they'll be going to be Gish 591 00:26:11,500 --> 00:26:10,280 gallop well I know that French effort I 592 00:26:13,500 --> 00:26:11,510 think said she was going to comment but 593 00:26:16,150 --> 00:26:13,510 I but you know there was no obvious 594 00:26:17,590 --> 00:26:16,160 anything obvious even to say here's how 595 00:26:19,270 --> 00:26:17,600 used to MIT and in fact the other thing 596 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:19,280 was and this is why I've been talking 597 00:26:23,710 --> 00:26:21,770 about it all over the radio was because 598 00:26:26,740 --> 00:26:23,720 it you know the statement was actually 599 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:26,750 sort of said don't distribute this yeah 600 00:26:31,630 --> 00:26:28,730 not for distribution it's like well how 601 00:26:34,360 --> 00:26:31,640 are you going to get comment on a draft 602 00:26:35,740 --> 00:26:34,370 statement from consumers and people if 603 00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:35,750 you're not even going to allow people to 604 00:26:39,039 --> 00:26:37,610 distribute it and that's why i blogged 605 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:39,049 about it in the first place because paul 606 00:26:42,610 --> 00:26:40,610 smith from australian doctor he got a 607 00:26:45,370 --> 00:26:42,620 copy of it and he wrote about it but 608 00:26:47,140 --> 00:26:45,380 that's behind a login pay wall yeah so 609 00:26:49,390 --> 00:26:47,150 then I had to blogger for my I blocked 610 00:26:50,830 --> 00:26:49,400 it from my blog and then when when I got 611 00:26:52,690 --> 00:26:50,840 the opportunity to do the cosmos thing I 612 00:26:54,940 --> 00:26:52,700 was like yes definitely because you know 613 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:54,950 that fears number one science mag in 614 00:26:58,270 --> 00:26:56,210 Australia and at least it's going to get 615 00:27:00,370 --> 00:26:58,280 out to a lot of people now of course a 616 00:27:02,140 --> 00:27:00,380 couple of episodes ago three or four you 617 00:27:04,090 --> 00:27:02,150 read out that that piece where listeners 618 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:04,100 and it's so good that you're getting 619 00:27:08,620 --> 00:27:06,410 more press coverage for that and I 620 00:27:11,350 --> 00:27:08,630 expect to the homeopaths will be on the 621 00:27:14,409 --> 00:27:11,360 warpath against you well I hope they are 622 00:27:17,169 --> 00:27:14,419 and you know what I don't care bring it 623 00:27:18,730 --> 00:27:17,179 on the thing is like today as well I was 624 00:27:22,419 --> 00:27:18,740 given an opportunity to speak for 625 00:27:25,570 --> 00:27:22,429 probably about 10 minutes to a guy at 626 00:27:27,250 --> 00:27:25,580 the ABC and I really was emphasizing the 627 00:27:29,650 --> 00:27:27,260 point that it's a consumer protection 628 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:29,660 issue you know it really is it and he 629 00:27:32,950 --> 00:27:31,490 said at one point in a long question to 630 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:32,960 me he started off the question by saying 631 00:27:38,289 --> 00:27:35,690 homeopathic medicine and I had to go 632 00:27:40,870 --> 00:27:38,299 back and correct him and say no that's a 633 00:27:43,030 --> 00:27:40,880 misnomer it's an oxymoron it's not 634 00:27:45,030 --> 00:27:43,040 medicine it doesn't work there's nothing 635 00:27:47,070 --> 00:27:45,040 in it you know so 636 00:27:49,020 --> 00:27:47,080 my whole sort of pushed with today's 637 00:27:51,330 --> 00:27:49,030 interview was that it is a consumer 638 00:27:52,470 --> 00:27:51,340 health issue europe i think don't know 639 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:52,480 it but i think that's one of the 640 00:27:59,400 --> 00:27:54,690 problems with this you know as I was in 641 00:28:01,470 --> 00:27:59,410 a pharmacy the other day which over the 642 00:28:04,650 --> 00:28:01,480 years I've watched become more and more 643 00:28:07,230 --> 00:28:04,660 Phil nonsense you know you look on the 644 00:28:11,070 --> 00:28:07,240 shelves and just everywhere you turn now 645 00:28:12,270 --> 00:28:11,080 you just you just can't build you can't 646 00:28:16,260 --> 00:28:12,280 turn a corner in the place without 647 00:28:18,090 --> 00:28:16,270 seeing absolute rubbish and and I think 648 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:18,100 part of the problem is it is it's just 649 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:20,410 becoming more in the part of the 650 00:28:26,370 --> 00:28:23,050 background and that makes it a lot 651 00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:26,380 harder to have a dialogue about it with 652 00:28:33,090 --> 00:28:30,850 with the public that has them seeing it 653 00:28:34,980 --> 00:28:33,100 as an issue that they should be taking 654 00:28:36,690 --> 00:28:34,990 notice of because they walk into their 655 00:28:39,330 --> 00:28:36,700 pharmacies and they see the stuff 656 00:28:42,180 --> 00:28:39,340 everywhere and your pharmacy somewhere 657 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:42,190 where you go to get medicines you go to 658 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:44,890 get things that I supposed to help you 659 00:28:52,230 --> 00:28:49,450 simplify osteria so if you go in there 660 00:28:55,220 --> 00:28:52,240 and that's what you see and everywhere 661 00:28:57,660 --> 00:28:55,230 you go every every magazine you pick up 662 00:28:59,940 --> 00:28:57,670 all sorts of natural things are being 663 00:29:01,980 --> 00:28:59,950 promoted and it's just become so much of 664 00:29:03,690 --> 00:29:01,990 the background noise now of what's just 665 00:29:06,270 --> 00:29:03,700 out of what's out there and it's just 666 00:29:09,090 --> 00:29:06,280 accepted and people just you know just 667 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:09,100 take it as normal that all these all 668 00:29:13,740 --> 00:29:11,410 these natural therapies are are 669 00:29:15,780 --> 00:29:13,750 acceptable because they must play mostly 670 00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:15,790 work they must be and it gets back to 671 00:29:20,250 --> 00:29:17,650 the point how is the punter the average 672 00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:20,260 customer supposed to know but box ex 673 00:29:24,660 --> 00:29:22,690 works in box why doesn't if they're both 674 00:29:27,390 --> 00:29:24,670 in a pharmacy and which brings us to the 675 00:29:29,700 --> 00:29:27,400 topic and the little clip I played last 676 00:29:31,980 --> 00:29:29,710 week from today tonight dr. a team where 677 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:31,990 you again getting around the media 678 00:29:36,780 --> 00:29:34,210 appeared on today tonight to talk about 679 00:29:38,610 --> 00:29:36,790 ear candles and that's gone down very 680 00:29:40,650 --> 00:29:38,620 well and you're just telling me you 681 00:29:43,380 --> 00:29:40,660 heard that was shown in Perth rigidly 682 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:43,390 yeah somebody left a comment on my 683 00:29:47,540 --> 00:29:46,210 Facebook page saying that they've seen 684 00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:47,550 it 685 00:29:51,900 --> 00:29:50,290 she is from Perth when I asked her she'd 686 00:29:54,330 --> 00:29:51,910 seen it on youtube or in person she said 687 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:54,340 it was on in Perth great yes I'm hoping 688 00:29:58,800 --> 00:29:56,530 that if it's aired in Perth and in 689 00:30:00,690 --> 00:29:58,810 Adelaide it might err in Sydney and 690 00:30:03,450 --> 00:30:00,700 Melbourne maybe as well I hope so i 691 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:03,460 think it was a great story and it really 692 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:05,530 made them look out to be completely and 693 00:30:10,650 --> 00:30:07,570 utterly stupid and outrageous and you 694 00:30:13,260 --> 00:30:10,660 came over absolutely credible and 695 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:13,270 knowledgeable and very pretty there 696 00:30:17,700 --> 00:30:14,970 sitting in that today tonight student ah 697 00:30:20,220 --> 00:30:17,710 well I put my face on for that you see 698 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:20,230 who did I did I put my face on yeah no I 699 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:21,730 mean it was funny wasn't it because i 700 00:30:26,220 --> 00:30:24,250 think i did i mention on the show that 701 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:26,230 we actually shot that about two weeks 702 00:30:32,670 --> 00:30:27,970 ago because you came into the studio 703 00:30:35,460 --> 00:30:32,680 with me to prompt me and then last 704 00:30:37,380 --> 00:30:35,470 friday i got a call from the producer on 705 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:37,390 a friday evening as i was walking home 706 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:40,210 to say that because the story was done 707 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:42,490 in adelaide but they shot my footage in 708 00:30:45,810 --> 00:30:44,170 Sydney and then sit in Sydney sent the 709 00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:45,820 footage to Adelaide to then splice it 710 00:30:50,610 --> 00:30:49,330 into the story now somehow Sydney extent 711 00:30:52,710 --> 00:30:50,620 their footage off to Adelaide and then 712 00:30:54,780 --> 00:30:52,720 deleted it from them hard drives in 713 00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:54,790 Sydney and then somehow Adelaide deleted 714 00:30:59,130 --> 00:30:56,170 it from their hard drives and Adelaide 715 00:31:00,870 --> 00:30:59,140 and so they lost the footage yeah so we 716 00:31:03,990 --> 00:31:00,880 had to go back in and do it again yeah 717 00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:04,000 about 10 days later oh yeah so me what 718 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:06,250 and I'm trance to rant about ear candles 719 00:31:09,930 --> 00:31:07,690 I'm sure that it was a really hard thing 720 00:31:12,060 --> 00:31:09,940 for you dude yeah it was awful what's 721 00:31:14,820 --> 00:31:12,070 right yeah what you had to process Joe 722 00:31:16,140 --> 00:31:14,830 because what happens and we've done this 723 00:31:18,210 --> 00:31:16,150 in Reverse when I was talking about 724 00:31:20,670 --> 00:31:18,220 homeopathy we sit around the table there 725 00:31:22,890 --> 00:31:20,680 were they film it and Rachel's on the 726 00:31:25,620 --> 00:31:22,900 camera and the producer asked Rachel the 727 00:31:27,030 --> 00:31:25,630 question which then I repeat and give 728 00:31:28,890 --> 00:31:27,040 her the answer which then she repeats 729 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:28,900 back to the producer you see it's a bit 730 00:31:33,630 --> 00:31:30,370 of a process but it worked up to Reggie 731 00:31:35,850 --> 00:31:33,640 yeah well it works well because I can't 732 00:31:37,290 --> 00:31:35,860 always remember exactly what yeah you 733 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:37,300 know we write the answers because they 734 00:31:40,290 --> 00:31:38,650 will send you questions you write the 735 00:31:41,460 --> 00:31:40,300 answers but then you can't always 736 00:31:42,570 --> 00:31:41,470 remember what you've written so it's 737 00:31:45,690 --> 00:31:42,580 actually helpful to have someone there 738 00:31:49,050 --> 00:31:45,700 prompting you nothing well that I have 739 00:31:52,470 --> 00:31:49,060 to ask I'd ask did you have to but you 740 00:31:55,450 --> 00:31:52,480 have to turn to your computer monitor 741 00:31:58,930 --> 00:31:55,460 and randomly click away looking at some 742 00:32:00,460 --> 00:31:58,940 Horton piece of research no Sheila I 743 00:32:02,470 --> 00:32:00,470 love it when they do that she had to 744 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:02,480 look at here candles I had two pegs me 745 00:32:06,549 --> 00:32:03,890 candles out of a box and look at them 746 00:32:08,500 --> 00:32:06,559 physically yeah would she did oh you 747 00:32:09,940 --> 00:32:08,510 know there's there is that chases get I 748 00:32:11,500 --> 00:32:09,950 don't know if listeners remember it 749 00:32:14,350 --> 00:32:11,510 where they said if anyone can be 750 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:14,360 conceived returned into an expert if you 751 00:32:18,580 --> 00:32:16,730 if you're showing handing files over to 752 00:32:20,889 --> 00:32:18,590 a secretarial walking down the corridor 753 00:32:23,380 --> 00:32:20,899 holding on to some important papers or 754 00:32:28,750 --> 00:32:23,390 strolling through you know the academia 755 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:31,540 well that is a I think very on her 756 00:32:35,170 --> 00:32:33,770 unhear ballbuster now yes it's getting a 757 00:32:36,910 --> 00:32:35,180 bit noisy in here more and more people 758 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:36,920 coming and never mind folks there was a 759 00:32:42,750 --> 00:32:39,290 bus announcement I promise you now we've 760 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:42,760 had some listeners riding into us a 761 00:32:47,020 --> 00:32:45,050 couple of people have commented that 762 00:32:49,690 --> 00:32:47,030 they thought it was an odd choice that 763 00:32:54,930 --> 00:32:49,700 may not interviewed adam curry from the 764 00:32:57,850 --> 00:32:54,940 no agenda podcast because in some of his 765 00:32:59,860 --> 00:32:57,860 thoughts he's really a bit out there and 766 00:33:04,960 --> 00:32:59,870 certainly stuff that the skeptic zone 767 00:33:07,990 --> 00:33:04,970 wouldn't endorse as such but maynard has 768 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:08,000 a habit of interviewing very interesting 769 00:33:11,530 --> 00:33:10,010 and sometimes wacky people so i was 770 00:33:15,580 --> 00:33:11,540 happy to let that one go but please 771 00:33:17,470 --> 00:33:15,590 don't think that we're endorsing the no 772 00:33:19,270 --> 00:33:17,480 agenda podcast if you want to listen to 773 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:19,280 it go right ahead if it's not your cup 774 00:33:23,110 --> 00:33:21,650 of tea that's fine I understand but 775 00:33:25,090 --> 00:33:23,120 thank you for those the scissors have 776 00:33:27,610 --> 00:33:25,100 written in expressing their concern I 777 00:33:31,090 --> 00:33:27,620 absolutely take that on board another 778 00:33:33,070 --> 00:33:31,100 listener poor and call him Paul which is 779 00:33:35,530 --> 00:33:33,080 his name rights to us with a very 780 00:33:38,110 --> 00:33:35,540 interesting question which are 781 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:38,120 summarized in that he's her had a family 782 00:33:44,410 --> 00:33:40,490 GP which he's known and trusted for many 783 00:33:47,380 --> 00:33:44,420 years and he asked how is it that 784 00:33:49,060 --> 00:33:47,390 somebody like this with a good 785 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:49,070 background in medicine for many years 786 00:33:54,340 --> 00:33:52,730 can turn and turn to the dark side and 787 00:33:56,860 --> 00:33:54,350 start advocating things like 788 00:33:59,500 --> 00:33:56,870 anti-vaccination or conspiracy theories 789 00:34:03,310 --> 00:33:59,510 or maybe even homeopathy or whatever it 790 00:34:06,780 --> 00:34:03,320 is Joe you might be someone to ask about 791 00:34:10,330 --> 00:34:06,790 this being a registered nurse have you 792 00:34:14,050 --> 00:34:10,340 experienced this um I haven't worked 793 00:34:16,690 --> 00:34:14,060 with any doctors who I've known to 794 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:16,700 endorse any of the things that we are 795 00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:19,210 concerned about like auntie backs 796 00:34:23,609 --> 00:34:21,970 or alternative treatments and so I 797 00:34:26,430 --> 00:34:23,619 certainly he'll know any of that but 798 00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:26,440 Chum and I and I think that it probably 799 00:34:35,730 --> 00:34:31,210 is unusual for someone to have always 800 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:35,740 been a I supposed conventional medical 801 00:34:40,740 --> 00:34:37,810 practitioner and then to suddenly turn 802 00:34:43,290 --> 00:34:40,750 yeah i think someone who is a strong 803 00:34:49,889 --> 00:34:43,300 believer in that kind of thing neither 804 00:34:51,300 --> 00:34:49,899 always was one or might i know look I 805 00:34:53,970 --> 00:34:51,310 think I think it's quite a complicated 806 00:34:58,800 --> 00:34:53,980 question and I think we've seen examples 807 00:35:00,210 --> 00:34:58,810 of it in fact one of the looking at it 808 00:35:03,210 --> 00:35:00,220 more from the point of view of the the 809 00:35:04,740 --> 00:35:03,220 doctor who may be always has doubled in 810 00:35:11,359 --> 00:35:04,750 these things or might end up going this 811 00:35:14,609 --> 00:35:11,369 way I think it was Stephen Barrett from 812 00:35:15,750 --> 00:35:14,619 Black Watch who actually and I've 813 00:35:18,839 --> 00:35:15,760 actually referenced this a couple of 814 00:35:22,500 --> 00:35:18,849 times when I've talked about why some 815 00:35:24,030 --> 00:35:22,510 nurses for example perhaps you know my 816 00:35:31,130 --> 00:35:24,040 practice things like therapeutic touch 817 00:35:35,660 --> 00:35:31,140 is that sometimes people who have not 818 00:35:39,170 --> 00:35:35,670 done well professionally may turn to 819 00:35:42,060 --> 00:35:39,180 other areas that they feel that they can 820 00:35:44,180 --> 00:35:42,070 be successful in so maybe someone who 821 00:35:47,820 --> 00:35:44,190 has not excelled in their profession 822 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:47,830 might go into an area where they can 823 00:35:55,650 --> 00:35:49,810 make all sorts of wild claims and be 824 00:35:58,620 --> 00:35:55,660 seen to be a maverick and so on met that 825 00:36:01,589 --> 00:35:58,630 that's one idea about it or even finding 826 00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:01,599 some sort of new credibility within a 827 00:36:05,839 --> 00:36:03,970 certain exactly era another way of 828 00:36:08,250 --> 00:36:05,849 looking at it also is you might get some 829 00:36:10,410 --> 00:36:08,260 people who work in areas I mean the 830 00:36:13,020 --> 00:36:10,420 thing about working in medicine or 831 00:36:15,570 --> 00:36:13,030 nursing or any of that kind of work is 832 00:36:16,890 --> 00:36:15,580 that you know if you you look at some of 833 00:36:21,450 --> 00:36:16,900 the areas that people work in like 834 00:36:23,910 --> 00:36:21,460 oncology or people who work in HIV you 835 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:23,920 know their areas of Medicine which can 836 00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:26,490 be incredibly depressing and 837 00:36:31,670 --> 00:36:29,490 and people can actually I think lose 838 00:36:33,620 --> 00:36:31,680 hope and repeatedly not being able to 839 00:36:35,750 --> 00:36:33,630 offer their patients much hope when when 840 00:36:38,540 --> 00:36:35,760 you're dealing with evenings and I just 841 00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:38,550 wonder whether at some level people who 842 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:42,810 maybe aren't equipped to cope with some 843 00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:44,010 of those things that they have to deal 844 00:36:48,380 --> 00:36:45,930 with their patients with some of the 845 00:36:51,470 --> 00:36:48,390 really awful things that we see every 846 00:36:52,940 --> 00:36:51,480 day maybe people who don't cope very 847 00:36:54,500 --> 00:36:52,950 well with seeing some of the horrible 848 00:36:58,310 --> 00:36:54,510 things their patients have to go through 849 00:37:01,010 --> 00:36:58,320 may over a period of time become 850 00:37:04,490 --> 00:37:01,020 disillusioned with conventional medicine 851 00:37:07,790 --> 00:37:04,500 and started looking at alternatives and 852 00:37:11,390 --> 00:37:07,800 have this perception that they are 853 00:37:13,700 --> 00:37:11,400 better and gentler and less yes and 854 00:37:15,620 --> 00:37:13,710 lateral and and I think what might 855 00:37:18,260 --> 00:37:15,630 happen is what happens a lot of these 856 00:37:20,660 --> 00:37:18,270 people be natural medicine alternative 857 00:37:26,540 --> 00:37:20,670 medicine or psychics or whatever is they 858 00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:26,550 begin to believe their own house is the 859 00:37:30,140 --> 00:37:28,530 word I'm looking for their own successes 860 00:37:32,180 --> 00:37:30,150 because they get the feedback loop from 861 00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:32,190 their patients you know the psychic will 862 00:37:35,599 --> 00:37:33,450 get the feedback loop saying you were 863 00:37:37,790 --> 00:37:35,609 amazing you're amazing exactly and if 864 00:37:40,580 --> 00:37:37,800 you're not if you're not um if you're 865 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:40,590 not applying critical thinking across 866 00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:42,330 the board to what you're doing then you 867 00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:45,570 are in danger of falling prey to a lot 868 00:37:48,650 --> 00:37:47,250 of those biases and you're going to 869 00:37:51,740 --> 00:37:48,660 you're going to have on publish it 870 00:37:53,720 --> 00:37:51,750 exactly so I think it's a very very 871 00:37:58,099 --> 00:37:53,730 complex issue i think we've you know 872 00:38:00,650 --> 00:37:58,109 we've got prominent medical people here 873 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:00,660 who we've you know heaps a lot of 874 00:38:07,550 --> 00:38:05,490 criticism on for for some of the the the 875 00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:07,560 things that they're promoting and 876 00:38:17,510 --> 00:38:11,330 purging and i think it's it's easy to 877 00:38:21,660 --> 00:38:19,620 somehow you know just pushing their own 878 00:38:24,150 --> 00:38:21,670 agenda but I think that it is it's 879 00:38:26,100 --> 00:38:24,160 really quite complex in terms of you 880 00:38:28,110 --> 00:38:26,110 know as we always say the human 881 00:38:29,730 --> 00:38:28,120 psychology behind it is more than just 882 00:38:32,180 --> 00:38:29,740 people being stupid or people being 883 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:32,190 silly and I think when it comes to 884 00:38:37,590 --> 00:38:34,570 people who are also you know doctors 885 00:38:39,780 --> 00:38:37,600 have a lot of power and and I think that 886 00:38:42,450 --> 00:38:39,790 there are issues there as well that that 887 00:38:45,210 --> 00:38:42,460 could be looked at and I think or you 888 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:45,220 know also you could say that sometimes 889 00:38:50,670 --> 00:38:47,650 someone could just be a not a very good 890 00:38:52,860 --> 00:38:50,680 doctor so I'm a highly actually I'd 891 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:52,870 highly recommend listening to a recent 892 00:38:58,650 --> 00:38:55,810 episode of the podcast radio show this 893 00:39:00,750 --> 00:38:58,660 american life which was this particular 894 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:00,760 episode was called old boys network and 895 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:04,090 it was about a texan nurse they were 896 00:39:06,720 --> 00:39:05,410 actually a couple of nurses enrolled but 897 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:06,730 the one in question was a nurse by the 898 00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:10,450 name of Anna Mitchell and and reported a 899 00:39:17,700 --> 00:39:15,130 doctor in their local hospital who they 900 00:39:21,180 --> 00:39:17,710 reported him for basically dangerous 901 00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:21,190 practices and she was facing jail time 902 00:39:26,310 --> 00:39:24,370 for utilizing whistleblowing laws it was 903 00:39:27,930 --> 00:39:26,320 a very very complicated case but this 904 00:39:30,420 --> 00:39:27,940 doctor was an example of someone who 905 00:39:32,730 --> 00:39:30,430 systematically went from you know one 906 00:39:35,460 --> 00:39:32,740 job to the next really practicing 907 00:39:38,780 --> 00:39:35,470 medicine very poorly and endangering his 908 00:39:40,890 --> 00:39:38,790 patients and he was also very much a 909 00:39:42,810 --> 00:39:40,900 proponent of a lot of alternative 910 00:39:45,300 --> 00:39:42,820 therapies and a lot of really quite 911 00:39:48,060 --> 00:39:45,310 dangerous and non evidence-based 912 00:39:51,570 --> 00:39:48,070 treatments and I think he was an example 913 00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:51,580 of someone who I think it was just not a 914 00:39:59,760 --> 00:39:56,050 good doctor it probably never was so 915 00:40:01,320 --> 00:39:59,770 yeah I think I think it's a very complex 916 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:01,330 issue and I think in someone like this 917 00:40:07,290 --> 00:40:04,090 particular doctor that sorry I forgot 918 00:40:12,090 --> 00:40:07,300 the name of that Paul was asking 919 00:40:14,070 --> 00:40:12,100 about you know this person may have had 920 00:40:15,340 --> 00:40:14,080 a life experience that may have changed 921 00:40:18,940 --> 00:40:15,350 his views on things 922 00:40:22,660 --> 00:40:18,950 or just become disillusioned with what 923 00:40:25,690 --> 00:40:22,670 he was doing I think you're absolutely 924 00:40:26,530 --> 00:40:25,700 right is a very complex issue and it 925 00:40:29,140 --> 00:40:26,540 would be different in different 926 00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:29,150 circumstances Paul I hope that helps you 927 00:40:35,230 --> 00:40:31,610 a little bit another listener by the 928 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:35,240 name of ex yes ex for very good reasons 929 00:40:43,890 --> 00:40:38,330 x asked us try saying that three times 930 00:40:47,260 --> 00:40:43,900 quickly excellent x.x no x asks us oh no 931 00:40:50,170 --> 00:40:47,270 excess us living with a partner for many 932 00:40:53,980 --> 00:40:50,180 years and nice happy marriage children 933 00:40:56,970 --> 00:40:53,990 involved but the partner has turned to 934 00:41:00,010 --> 00:40:56,980 the dark side again to woo or two 935 00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:00,020 strange religious cult or along these 936 00:41:06,430 --> 00:41:03,050 lines and x is finding this situation 937 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:06,440 very difficult to deal with this is 938 00:41:12,130 --> 00:41:08,690 another issue which is very complicated 939 00:41:14,110 --> 00:41:12,140 I think Joe hmm absolutely what can you 940 00:41:16,930 --> 00:41:14,120 say I mean is that it's really hard to 941 00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:16,940 give advice in this situation well what 942 00:41:23,020 --> 00:41:20,330 does X want us to do this fixes 943 00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:23,030 relationship problem actually like us to 944 00:41:28,270 --> 00:41:25,970 give it to the optic zone ask Abby is 945 00:41:29,380 --> 00:41:28,280 asked the skeptic zone no it wouldn't be 946 00:41:31,030 --> 00:41:29,390 an interesting topic for conversation 947 00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:31,040 because I think a lot of people out 948 00:41:38,110 --> 00:41:33,290 there would find themselves in a similar 949 00:41:41,500 --> 00:41:38,120 situation hmm look I mean I'm lucky I'm 950 00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:41,510 lucky enough that that my my husband and 951 00:41:47,890 --> 00:41:44,690 I both share very similar views about 952 00:41:50,170 --> 00:41:47,900 all this but I think it really depends 953 00:41:51,700 --> 00:41:50,180 on on what that person's doing I mean I 954 00:41:53,980 --> 00:41:51,710 think that in any relationship people 955 00:41:57,130 --> 00:41:53,990 have you know don't agree on everything 956 00:41:58,930 --> 00:41:57,140 you know there are marriages where you 957 00:42:00,580 --> 00:41:58,940 know one person has a completely 958 00:42:02,950 --> 00:42:00,590 different political view to the other 959 00:42:04,660 --> 00:42:02,960 and they somehow manage to build a 960 00:42:06,580 --> 00:42:04,670 strong enough relationship that it can 961 00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:06,590 overcome those barriers but when it 962 00:42:11,350 --> 00:42:08,570 comes to something like alternative 963 00:42:13,540 --> 00:42:11,360 medicine I guess the thing is it depends 964 00:42:15,430 --> 00:42:13,550 on how to impact in their life if for 965 00:42:18,860 --> 00:42:15,440 example if you had a situation where you 966 00:42:22,070 --> 00:42:18,870 you've got a couple who have children 967 00:42:24,050 --> 00:42:22,080 and 32 years yeah and and the person is 968 00:42:26,720 --> 00:42:24,060 wanting to for example not vaccinate 969 00:42:30,580 --> 00:42:26,730 their children because they've become a 970 00:42:32,780 --> 00:42:30,590 you know they've found that there now 971 00:42:35,150 --> 00:42:32,790 opposing vaccination and the other 972 00:42:37,940 --> 00:42:35,160 partner feels the office then that is a 973 00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:37,950 very very difficult situation and one 974 00:42:40,970 --> 00:42:39,450 which could really break down a marriage 975 00:42:42,620 --> 00:42:40,980 but if it's just a matter of your 976 00:42:44,990 --> 00:42:42,630 partner going off and dabbling in a bit 977 00:42:47,860 --> 00:42:45,000 of you know a bit of homeopathy here or 978 00:42:50,300 --> 00:42:47,870 there as distasteful as that might be um 979 00:42:52,220 --> 00:42:50,310 you know I think it's something that if 980 00:42:53,510 --> 00:42:52,230 if the relationship strong enough you 981 00:42:55,580 --> 00:42:53,520 should be able to overcome it and 982 00:42:57,020 --> 00:42:55,590 certainly you're not going to like that 983 00:42:58,340 --> 00:42:57,030 anything that we deal with you're not 984 00:42:59,930 --> 00:42:58,350 going to be able to get a person to stop 985 00:43:02,240 --> 00:42:59,940 doing it by telling them how much you 986 00:43:04,310 --> 00:43:02,250 disapprove of it no because it's just 987 00:43:05,810 --> 00:43:04,320 gonna it's going to make them you know I 988 00:43:10,130 --> 00:43:05,820 feel that you think that they're stupid 989 00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:10,140 and you know I think and think I think a 990 00:43:13,130 --> 00:43:11,370 lot of a lot of people have talked about 991 00:43:15,710 --> 00:43:13,140 this brian dunning talk about it is 992 00:43:17,720 --> 00:43:15,720 podcast and so on and I think that it's 993 00:43:19,130 --> 00:43:17,730 about just a big title Brian Dunning 994 00:43:21,500 --> 00:43:19,140 talks about it in the latest issue of 995 00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:21,510 the magazine yeah the stabbings miss 996 00:43:26,540 --> 00:43:24,690 Joan skipton are you only great I happen 997 00:43:28,730 --> 00:43:26,550 to know someone who used to go out with 998 00:43:30,380 --> 00:43:28,740 someone who really did all that stuff as 999 00:43:32,180 --> 00:43:30,390 well and I mean their relationship 1000 00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:32,190 lasted from reasonably long time a 1001 00:43:37,010 --> 00:43:35,610 number of years but I think Joe makes 1002 00:43:41,810 --> 00:43:37,020 the point of you know it depends on how 1003 00:43:43,940 --> 00:43:41,820 serious the issue is and I'm like like 1004 00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:43,950 Joe my partner is also doesn't tolerate 1005 00:43:50,180 --> 00:43:48,090 any of these stuff so we could be wheel 1006 00:43:53,870 --> 00:43:50,190 all about it and had desk a lot and you 1007 00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:53,880 know herb door and stuff but um yeah I 1008 00:43:58,730 --> 00:43:57,210 suppose it is one of those really 1009 00:44:00,380 --> 00:43:58,740 naughty issues isn't it there's just no 1010 00:44:03,349 --> 00:44:00,390 clear answer here 1011 00:44:05,779 --> 00:44:03,359 and on on the individual circumstance 1012 00:44:07,490 --> 00:44:05,789 but then it also might be unless it is 1013 00:44:08,779 --> 00:44:07,500 becoming an issue where your children's 1014 00:44:10,670 --> 00:44:08,789 health is being affected as Joan 1015 00:44:12,109 --> 00:44:10,680 suggested it might just be better just 1016 00:44:13,789 --> 00:44:12,119 to not talk about it you know i mean 1017 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:13,799 that's your thing and this is my thing 1018 00:44:18,620 --> 00:44:16,410 and yeah never that we shall meet i mean 1019 00:44:20,779 --> 00:44:18,630 if it's a point where you can't agree 1020 00:44:21,980 --> 00:44:20,789 then you just agree to disagree I mean 1021 00:44:23,660 --> 00:44:21,990 it make it to the point of having to 1022 00:44:25,130 --> 00:44:23,670 have separate cabinets in the bathroom 1023 00:44:28,190 --> 00:44:25,140 so that you don't have to open it and 1024 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:28,200 look at what horrible weird products 1025 00:44:32,210 --> 00:44:30,450 they keeping you now yeah we're talking 1026 00:44:34,940 --> 00:44:32,220 about in relation to for example if 1027 00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:34,950 someone's going through a diagnosis of a 1028 00:44:38,329 --> 00:44:36,450 serious illness and got to make a 1029 00:44:40,069 --> 00:44:38,339 decision about the treatments and you 1030 00:44:41,630 --> 00:44:40,079 know what would you do if your partner 1031 00:44:44,599 --> 00:44:41,640 for example if you've been diagnosed 1032 00:44:48,259 --> 00:44:44,609 with if your partner had been diagnosed 1033 00:44:50,420 --> 00:44:48,269 with cancer and wanted to go off and try 1034 00:44:53,450 --> 00:44:50,430 all sorts of you know weird therapies 1035 00:44:56,630 --> 00:44:53,460 and you didn't endorse that I mean it's 1036 00:44:59,829 --> 00:44:56,640 it's a really hard situation and what I 1037 00:45:03,019 --> 00:44:59,839 was saying was that i think you know 1038 00:45:04,990 --> 00:45:03,029 what do you tell people about what to do 1039 00:45:07,999 --> 00:45:05,000 when someone who's close to you is 1040 00:45:10,430 --> 00:45:08,009 choosing to do something or who is 1041 00:45:12,650 --> 00:45:10,440 asking questions about things that you 1042 00:45:16,370 --> 00:45:12,660 know won't work when they've been given 1043 00:45:18,259 --> 00:45:16,380 a horrible diagnosis and i think i think 1044 00:45:21,529 --> 00:45:18,269 the you know one way to go about it 1045 00:45:24,170 --> 00:45:21,539 which which i've suggested is you know 1046 00:45:29,079 --> 00:45:24,180 to just say to a person that you know 1047 00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:29,089 they are faced with terrible situation 1048 00:45:34,220 --> 00:45:31,650 and that that when people have a 1049 00:45:35,359 --> 00:45:34,230 diagnosis that is very scary they'll go 1050 00:45:37,279 --> 00:45:35,369 looking on the internet for information 1051 00:45:39,230 --> 00:45:37,289 and what they're going to find out there 1052 00:45:44,269 --> 00:45:39,240 is going to be very confusing because 1053 00:45:47,240 --> 00:45:44,279 you go into dr. google and you see cures 1054 00:45:50,089 --> 00:45:47,250 and all sorts of offers of things that 1055 00:45:52,490 --> 00:45:50,099 seem very enticing when you potentially 1056 00:45:54,470 --> 00:45:52,500 got something if a doctor tells you that 1057 00:45:56,059 --> 00:45:54,480 you have been diagnosed with something 1058 00:45:59,210 --> 00:45:56,069 that's incurable and the first thing you 1059 00:46:02,210 --> 00:45:59,220 see is there's a cure well well what are 1060 00:46:03,950 --> 00:46:02,220 you going to do yeah and i think you 1061 00:46:05,390 --> 00:46:03,960 know you could 1062 00:46:07,130 --> 00:46:05,400 you know put someone who's close to you 1063 00:46:08,750 --> 00:46:07,140 the best way to do it without you know 1064 00:46:10,540 --> 00:46:08,760 making them feel that you're turning 1065 00:46:13,310 --> 00:46:10,550 them away from those options is to just 1066 00:46:14,570 --> 00:46:13,320 reassure them that doctors are offering 1067 00:46:16,940 --> 00:46:14,580 them the best treatments available 1068 00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:16,950 because they have been shown to give 1069 00:46:20,060 --> 00:46:18,810 them the best options you know doctors 1070 00:46:21,829 --> 00:46:20,070 don't the doctors don't want to deny 1071 00:46:23,570 --> 00:46:21,839 them those things and the things that 1072 00:46:27,410 --> 00:46:23,580 are out there unfortunately as enticing 1073 00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:27,420 as they may be just don't have anything 1074 00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:29,010 behind them to show them that they work 1075 00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:31,770 well your partner see you yeah yeah I 1076 00:46:38,030 --> 00:46:34,290 think the other thing that I've done in 1077 00:46:39,620 --> 00:46:38,040 the past too is just emphasized that if 1078 00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:39,630 you do want to go and try it it's tough 1079 00:46:44,930 --> 00:46:42,450 then go ahead but as long as you 1080 00:46:47,060 --> 00:46:44,940 maintain and you stick to your regime of 1081 00:46:49,220 --> 00:46:47,070 conventional science based trade you 1082 00:46:51,079 --> 00:46:49,230 tell your doctor yeah yeah you tell your 1083 00:46:52,099 --> 00:46:51,089 doctor if you take was a very important 1084 00:46:54,260 --> 00:46:52,109 point we were just having a quick 1085 00:46:55,790 --> 00:46:54,270 discussion before that we were recording 1086 00:46:57,470 --> 00:46:55,800 that a lot of people don't tell their 1087 00:46:58,579 --> 00:46:57,480 doctor then they're taking often yes 1088 00:47:00,410 --> 00:46:58,589 something like well for I've been 1089 00:47:04,670 --> 00:47:00,420 reading some papers recently on cam and 1090 00:47:05,810 --> 00:47:04,680 sort of HIV in particular and the stats 1091 00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:05,820 that they come up with something like 1092 00:47:09,260 --> 00:47:07,650 fifty percent of people don't tell their 1093 00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:09,270 doctor that they're taking cam and in 1094 00:47:14,420 --> 00:47:11,490 cases like for example with ginkgo 1095 00:47:15,980 --> 00:47:14,430 biloba and john's wort for example that 1096 00:47:17,780 --> 00:47:15,990 there is it has cut those things that 1097 00:47:20,060 --> 00:47:17,790 are contraindicated with them with 1098 00:47:23,690 --> 00:47:20,070 highly active antiretroviral therapy 1099 00:47:26,420 --> 00:47:23,700 with heart so it can actually modify the 1100 00:47:29,180 --> 00:47:26,430 way that your drugs work so it's really 1101 00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:29,190 important that if you and I can 1102 00:47:33,370 --> 00:47:30,570 completely understand that people would 1103 00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:33,380 want to you know drink seaweed juices or 1104 00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:36,690 you know get some kind of massage if 1105 00:47:41,420 --> 00:47:39,930 they're they've been given a you know 1106 00:47:43,670 --> 00:47:41,430 been told that they're going to die of 1107 00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:43,680 cancer at six months but just make sure 1108 00:47:47,630 --> 00:47:46,290 that you're telling your oncologist that 1109 00:47:49,010 --> 00:47:47,640 you're doing that and that you're 1110 00:47:50,839 --> 00:47:49,020 sticking with your evidence based 1111 00:47:52,420 --> 00:47:50,849 medicine as well and whatever else you 1112 00:47:56,060 --> 00:47:52,430 want to do to make yourself feel better 1113 00:47:57,620 --> 00:47:56,070 go for it yeah I would agree absolutely 1114 00:47:59,359 --> 00:47:57,630 i'd agree i think i'd be honing into the 1115 00:48:00,829 --> 00:47:59,369 peanut butter if i was doing that well 1116 00:48:02,210 --> 00:48:00,839 it's that make me feel good and I just 1117 00:48:03,950 --> 00:48:02,220 make a point there then because I made 1118 00:48:06,950 --> 00:48:03,960 this point I make this point in my talk 1119 00:48:08,150 --> 00:48:06,960 about hair analysis is that if peanut 1120 00:48:10,190 --> 00:48:08,160 butter is your favorite thing and you're 1121 00:48:12,079 --> 00:48:10,200 going to die in six months and somebody 1122 00:48:13,309 --> 00:48:12,089 does analysis of your heritage you're 1123 00:48:14,569 --> 00:48:13,319 allergic to 1124 00:48:17,299 --> 00:48:14,579 butter and it's causing your cancer 1125 00:48:20,630 --> 00:48:17,309 don't listen to them yes eat as much 1126 00:48:22,430 --> 00:48:20,640 peanut butter as you want because the 1127 00:48:24,229 --> 00:48:22,440 equivalent for me would be if some 1128 00:48:26,539 --> 00:48:24,239 numpty said to me or you're allergic to 1129 00:48:28,189 --> 00:48:26,549 white wine and champagne you're going to 1130 00:48:32,180 --> 00:48:28,199 die in six months so don't drink any of 1131 00:48:35,079 --> 00:48:32,190 that why do you the best thing I'm doing 1132 00:48:37,609 --> 00:48:35,089 is ordering in cartons and runs of booze 1133 00:48:40,189 --> 00:48:37,619 I'm going to die anyway and so coming 1134 00:48:43,489 --> 00:48:40,199 back to X it was all about what happens 1135 00:48:46,130 --> 00:48:43,499 if it's your spouse that's doing and I 1136 00:48:47,630 --> 00:48:46,140 think the main thing is that if you and 1137 00:48:51,349 --> 00:48:47,640 your spouse have a good relationship in 1138 00:48:53,049 --> 00:48:51,359 the first place the point then good 1139 00:48:56,209 --> 00:48:53,059 point but again it's one of those 1140 00:48:57,859 --> 00:48:56,219 incredibly complicated each user's the 1141 00:49:00,589 --> 00:48:57,869 defense depends how far down the rabbit 1142 00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:00,599 hole they've gone I suppose yeah now the 1143 00:49:07,569 --> 00:49:05,130 final topic will cover was another email 1144 00:49:12,170 --> 00:49:07,579 from a listener Rob Derby who lives in 1145 00:49:14,569 --> 00:49:12,180 Victoria is having issue with the 1146 00:49:18,140 --> 00:49:14,579 victorian state school system and their 1147 00:49:20,779 --> 00:49:18,150 religious education classes and he has 1148 00:49:23,359 --> 00:49:20,789 particular issue with a group called 1149 00:49:26,029 --> 00:49:23,369 access ministries who are coming into 1150 00:49:29,809 --> 00:49:26,039 the schools to give the kitties the true 1151 00:49:31,489 --> 00:49:29,819 Word of God and their stated slogan or 1152 00:49:34,339 --> 00:49:31,499 the claim on their website or their 1153 00:49:39,130 --> 00:49:34,349 mission to position missionary position 1154 00:49:44,689 --> 00:49:42,949 transforming this nation for God so 1155 00:49:46,789 --> 00:49:44,699 that's quite something now he has a 1156 00:49:48,019 --> 00:49:46,799 five-year-old son and so the sun's going 1157 00:49:50,959 --> 00:49:48,029 to be entering the school system pretty 1158 00:49:52,150 --> 00:49:50,969 soon he's been writing letters he's 1159 00:49:54,859 --> 00:49:52,160 written to the Minister for education 1160 00:49:57,680 --> 00:49:54,869 asking why special religious instruction 1161 00:49:59,660 --> 00:49:57,690 and asking for special religious 1162 00:50:02,420 --> 00:49:59,670 instruction to be removed from state 1163 00:50:04,999 --> 00:50:02,430 schools and he's had a long email 1164 00:50:07,099 --> 00:50:05,009 exchange of the local paper the ballarat 1165 00:50:08,449 --> 00:50:07,109 Korea where he'll write his point of 1166 00:50:11,089 --> 00:50:08,459 view and other people come back and 1167 00:50:13,900 --> 00:50:11,099 write their point of view and one of the 1168 00:50:17,749 --> 00:50:13,910 points of view to against him which 1169 00:50:20,239 --> 00:50:17,759 struck me was a woman wrote in saying 1170 00:50:22,339 --> 00:50:20,249 that in her day they had no choice and 1171 00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:22,349 they had to have religious instruction 1172 00:50:27,950 --> 00:50:25,530 therefore you know didn't 1173 00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:27,960 us any harm there for the children 1174 00:50:32,570 --> 00:50:29,370 should have no choice these days it just 1175 00:50:34,310 --> 00:50:32,580 strikes me as beyond bizarre when you 1176 00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:34,320 I'm sorry you didn't have a choice but 1177 00:50:39,230 --> 00:50:36,450 you know we live in a better society now 1178 00:50:40,760 --> 00:50:39,240 maybe if you want to find out more so 1179 00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:40,770 hang on a second so if that argument 1180 00:50:45,770 --> 00:50:43,050 stands then what in the 50s when we 1181 00:50:47,650 --> 00:50:45,780 didn't have radiotherapy but we do now 1182 00:50:51,050 --> 00:50:47,660 would she not choose that either 1183 00:50:53,540 --> 00:50:51,060 absolutely multi numpties but this is a 1184 00:50:55,220 --> 00:50:53,550 big big issue at the moment you know 1185 00:50:57,890 --> 00:50:55,230 religious annotation in state schools 1186 00:51:00,350 --> 00:50:57,900 because unlike the United States where 1187 00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:00,360 they've got the separation more 1188 00:51:04,490 --> 00:51:01,770 entrenched in their in their 1189 00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:04,500 constitution like this we do which it is 1190 00:51:08,450 --> 00:51:06,210 pretty entrenched in our Constitution 1191 00:51:10,100 --> 00:51:08,460 it's not enforced I mean every in all 1192 00:51:11,810 --> 00:51:10,110 the state schools my nephews and nieces 1193 00:51:14,270 --> 00:51:11,820 go to schools were every week there's 1194 00:51:15,770 --> 00:51:14,280 religious instruction you know I was 1195 00:51:17,090 --> 00:51:15,780 there one day when they were doing and 1196 00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:17,100 it was really funny the bell rang they 1197 00:51:21,170 --> 00:51:18,570 said right all the Muslims go to this 1198 00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:21,180 room the Christians yeah it's true you 1199 00:51:25,010 --> 00:51:22,530 know the Baptist here the run program 1200 00:51:27,590 --> 00:51:25,020 dramudam cuz modern how many gods are 1201 00:51:29,660 --> 00:51:27,600 there I mean rooms did I have their my 1202 00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:29,670 room forever got because modern school 1203 00:51:34,940 --> 00:51:31,410 in Sydney Australia there's children 1204 00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:34,950 there from lots of backgrounds you know 1205 00:51:42,610 --> 00:51:38,130 I'm saying but anyway robbers in there 1206 00:51:45,020 --> 00:51:42,620 fighting for his point of view and 1207 00:51:46,610 --> 00:51:45,030 needless to say that I think we broadly 1208 00:51:48,530 --> 00:51:46,620 agree with his point of view that it 1209 00:51:49,970 --> 00:51:48,540 shouldn't be in the state schools he 1210 00:51:51,590 --> 00:51:49,980 makes the point in these letters if they 1211 00:51:53,300 --> 00:51:51,600 want to do it outside school hours or 1212 00:51:54,950 --> 00:51:53,310 sunday school or whatever then that's 1213 00:51:57,170 --> 00:51:54,960 their right they're entitled to and that 1214 00:51:59,780 --> 00:51:57,180 should be defended even you know we all 1215 00:52:03,560 --> 00:51:59,790 agree on that but not in our school zone 1216 00:52:07,070 --> 00:52:03,570 what do you think i agree i think it's 1217 00:52:09,470 --> 00:52:07,080 it's a it's a very political it's a very 1218 00:52:10,730 --> 00:52:09,480 politicized issue probably well partly 1219 00:52:14,180 --> 00:52:10,740 because of the fact that the government 1220 00:52:16,070 --> 00:52:14,190 is actually funding you know you know 1221 00:52:17,760 --> 00:52:16,080 chaplains and chaplains in schools as 1222 00:52:20,610 --> 00:52:17,770 well 1223 00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:20,620 so it raises a lot of a lot of issues 1224 00:52:27,030 --> 00:52:23,770 which again people who people who don't 1225 00:52:28,410 --> 00:52:27,040 really care either way you know and like 1226 00:52:30,510 --> 00:52:28,420 this person who wrote in and said well 1227 00:52:31,590 --> 00:52:30,520 it didn't do us any harm so what does it 1228 00:52:33,840 --> 00:52:31,600 really matter and everyone should just 1229 00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:33,850 have to do it then you know people just 1230 00:52:37,860 --> 00:52:34,930 aren't going to care about it but I 1231 00:52:41,460 --> 00:52:37,870 think people who are secular who don't 1232 00:52:44,550 --> 00:52:41,470 want their children you know being put 1233 00:52:45,930 --> 00:52:44,560 in a position where they're having to or 1234 00:52:49,050 --> 00:52:45,940 being treated like second-class citizens 1235 00:52:51,720 --> 00:52:49,060 when the religious education is on let 1236 00:52:53,250 --> 00:52:51,730 me say well okay so you're not going 1237 00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:53,260 will you go and sit in the library or 1238 00:52:56,790 --> 00:52:54,850 you do this oh we should make that point 1239 00:52:59,310 --> 00:52:56,800 actually that if you don't you do have a 1240 00:53:01,830 --> 00:52:59,320 choice to not go but if you choose not 1241 00:53:03,780 --> 00:53:01,840 to go currently in most schools except 1242 00:53:05,490 --> 00:53:03,790 where the ethics trials are running mmm 1243 00:53:07,470 --> 00:53:05,500 you're not allowed to do anything else 1244 00:53:09,720 --> 00:53:07,480 and we had we had to talk about that a 1245 00:53:11,310 --> 00:53:09,730 couple of weeks ago yeah but I thought 1246 00:53:12,930 --> 00:53:11,320 that um the guy who was talking about 1247 00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:12,940 that who designed the ethics classes in 1248 00:53:18,180 --> 00:53:16,210 New South Wales I think I don't think 1249 00:53:20,490 --> 00:53:18,190 they have them in Victoria yet do they 1250 00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:20,500 or anywhere else in the country so I'm 1251 00:53:25,910 --> 00:53:23,410 not exactly sure and Rob is talking 1252 00:53:28,290 --> 00:53:25,920 about Ballarat which is in Victoria so 1253 00:53:29,610 --> 00:53:28,300 one of the points that the guy that 1254 00:53:30,720 --> 00:53:29,620 designed them in year South Wales 1255 00:53:33,780 --> 00:53:30,730 brought up which I thought was really 1256 00:53:35,220 --> 00:53:33,790 poignant actually it was that if there 1257 00:53:38,010 --> 00:53:35,230 are kids that choose not to go to that 1258 00:53:39,870 --> 00:53:38,020 class and then the kids that go to the 1259 00:53:41,610 --> 00:53:39,880 religious class they're taught that you 1260 00:53:43,620 --> 00:53:41,620 know if you're not a Christian you'll go 1261 00:53:45,300 --> 00:53:43,630 to hell and you'll burn in hell that's 1262 00:53:46,590 --> 00:53:45,310 right and so these kids are coming out 1263 00:53:48,870 --> 00:53:46,600 of these classes and saying to their 1264 00:53:51,870 --> 00:53:48,880 classmates you know that you're going to 1265 00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:51,880 burn in hell and then there they're put 1266 00:53:54,690 --> 00:53:53,050 in this position where they think they 1267 00:53:56,610 --> 00:53:54,700 can't be friends with their other kids 1268 00:53:59,610 --> 00:53:56,620 anymore because they don't believe in 1269 00:54:02,460 --> 00:53:59,620 God daily that sounds like religion but 1270 00:54:04,470 --> 00:54:02,470 it's pretty true but it's splitting his 1271 00:54:06,150 --> 00:54:04,480 point was it's actually very Jabbar it's 1272 00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:06,160 very divisive yeah and its fracturing 1273 00:54:09,300 --> 00:54:07,810 these kids and they're so young I may 1274 00:54:10,500 --> 00:54:09,310 not understand he was actually saying 1275 00:54:13,170 --> 00:54:10,510 that some of them will come out crying 1276 00:54:14,430 --> 00:54:13,180 because my mate Bobby who I hang out 1277 00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:14,440 with I can't hang out with him anymore 1278 00:54:18,270 --> 00:54:16,690 or you know he's going to burn in hell 1279 00:54:20,760 --> 00:54:18,280 because he didn't come to religion class 1280 00:54:24,540 --> 00:54:20,770 yeah cuz he doesn't believe in the deity 1281 00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:24,550 that yeah and so I mean it and so this 1282 00:54:27,840 --> 00:54:25,810 lady that says well it doesn't hurt 1283 00:54:29,460 --> 00:54:27,850 anyone well the jars in that sense and 1284 00:54:29,940 --> 00:54:29,470 you know these kids are being sent 1285 00:54:31,230 --> 00:54:29,950 because 1286 00:54:34,170 --> 00:54:31,240 their parents are telling them to go as 1287 00:54:36,359 --> 00:54:34,180 well same as the ones that are going so 1288 00:54:37,650 --> 00:54:36,369 it's not the kids decision to go to the 1289 00:54:38,849 --> 00:54:37,660 classes it's the parents and then it 1290 00:54:39,930 --> 00:54:38,859 puts the kids in a position where 1291 00:54:42,359 --> 00:54:39,940 they're thinking they're friends are 1292 00:54:44,940 --> 00:54:42,369 going to burn in hell it's really awful 1293 00:54:46,740 --> 00:54:44,950 so I definitely do it on sunday is away 1294 00:54:49,980 --> 00:54:46,750 from that environment you know because 1295 00:54:52,020 --> 00:54:49,990 it's a it's a horrible thing to put kids 1296 00:54:54,450 --> 00:54:52,030 at such a young age in that situation I 1297 00:54:55,890 --> 00:54:54,460 totally agree when I was a Catholic and 1298 00:54:59,940 --> 00:54:55,900 look what happened to me there you go 1299 00:55:01,530 --> 00:54:59,950 proof positive thanks it is perfect well 1300 00:55:03,780 --> 00:55:01,540 thanks Rob for riding in a very 1301 00:55:06,240 --> 00:55:03,790 interesting topic which certainly isn't 1302 00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:06,250 going away and well done for keeping up 1303 00:55:12,300 --> 00:55:08,770 your protests through the local paper 1304 00:55:13,710 --> 00:55:12,310 the Ballarat courier well that brings a 1305 00:55:16,380 --> 00:55:13,720 close and we've finished our drinks 1306 00:55:18,690 --> 00:55:16,390 action a little bit left that brings it 1307 00:55:21,240 --> 00:55:18,700 close to our think tank tonight thank 1308 00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:21,250 you Joe for making the long trek I think 1309 00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:24,010 you know can I just ask you how long is 1310 00:55:32,490 --> 00:55:30,130 it chill town Oh Green Week sure not 1311 00:55:35,130 --> 00:55:32,500 long suck little over two weeks and days 1312 00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:35,140 isn't going so I just have to say I am 1313 00:55:41,940 --> 00:55:39,010 devastated that I'm not know we had such 1314 00:55:43,740 --> 00:55:41,950 a great time last ideas we stayed up we 1315 00:55:45,270 --> 00:55:43,750 stayed up and kept drinking so we'd get 1316 00:55:47,670 --> 00:55:45,280 over jet lag and that's what we met 1317 00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:47,680 Lawrence lean we did and I thought he 1318 00:55:53,609 --> 00:55:50,170 was her age aside from a band was also 1319 00:55:56,040 --> 00:55:53,619 can I ask that at time yes yes if the 1320 00:56:01,079 --> 00:55:56,050 skeptics own table is within pelting 1321 00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:01,089 shot of the SGU table please please help 1322 00:56:05,670 --> 00:56:03,970 them for me with Minty's I'll pack some 1323 00:56:07,620 --> 00:56:05,680 Mindy's and we'll be doing that and 1324 00:56:12,599 --> 00:56:07,630 we'll have an extra portion of Krabby 1325 00:56:15,359 --> 00:56:12,609 legs for you oh we will okay that my 1326 00:56:18,300 --> 00:56:15,369 good I've got to eat something Chris 1327 00:56:20,069 --> 00:56:18,310 Higgins as well yes all right I have to 1328 00:56:22,020 --> 00:56:20,079 eat some on behalf of every skeptic zone 1329 00:56:23,819 --> 00:56:22,030 listener who won't be there you just 1330 00:56:26,460 --> 00:56:23,829 made that up I did yeah Chris and I I 1331 00:56:27,839 --> 00:56:26,470 think are going to be drowning our 1332 00:56:29,730 --> 00:56:27,849 sorrows the week that you are all at 1333 00:56:31,530 --> 00:56:29,740 town well Chris already gave me three 1334 00:56:33,190 --> 00:56:31,540 Packers of tim tams to take over there 1335 00:56:37,530 --> 00:56:33,200 the message is 1336 00:56:41,550 --> 00:56:37,540 who termed him yes Tamkin is on in fact 1337 00:56:45,490 --> 00:56:41,560 in fact there is a Facebook page for 1338 00:56:49,210 --> 00:56:45,500 Hampton really for he started by Chris 1339 00:56:52,090 --> 00:56:49,220 Higgins those of us who will be going to 1340 00:56:54,460 --> 00:56:52,100 dampen and I think Chris and I are the 1341 00:56:57,640 --> 00:56:54,470 only people on there oh really yes oh 1342 00:56:59,620 --> 00:56:57,650 well i'll join ya in a way I sort of 1343 00:57:01,480 --> 00:56:59,630 hope I'm not involved with a TV 1344 00:57:03,640 --> 00:57:01,490 production so I can actually go and 1345 00:57:05,710 --> 00:57:03,650 enjoy all of town Richard I don't think 1346 00:57:09,040 --> 00:57:05,720 that's going to stop you oh good I'll 1347 00:57:10,360 --> 00:57:09,050 still go anyway thank you very much Joe 1348 00:57:12,460 --> 00:57:10,370 for making a long ticket are saying 1349 00:57:13,900 --> 00:57:12,470 thank you very much dr. hu glad to see 1350 00:57:16,120 --> 00:57:13,910 you back from your wonderful time in 1351 00:57:18,190 --> 00:57:16,130 Melbourne thank you and thank you very 1352 00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:18,200 much Richard sort oh it's me for coming 1353 00:57:23,770 --> 00:57:21,050 along to it integ to the kids already 1354 00:57:26,260 --> 00:57:23,780 yeah Wiz this attending to a children's 1355 00:57:28,570 --> 00:57:26,270 playground here tonight and under the 1356 00:57:54,140 --> 00:57:28,580 next think tank which may well be after 1357 00:57:59,790 --> 00:57:56,670 thank you for listening to the skeptic 1358 00:58:03,660 --> 00:57:59,800 zone which brings us all one hour closer 1359 00:58:07,140 --> 00:58:03,670 to the amazing meeting all those Krabby 1360 00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:07,150 legs oh boy I just can't wait there'll 1361 00:58:12,360 --> 00:58:08,650 be a few people there from Australian 1362 00:58:15,120 --> 00:58:12,370 skeptics our secretary in fact in our 1363 00:58:16,740 --> 00:58:15,130 treasurer Jessica singer and Martin 1364 00:58:18,570 --> 00:58:16,750 Hadley they will be there dr. Rietz 1365 00:58:20,430 --> 00:58:18,580 you'll be there I'll be there and I'm 1366 00:58:24,380 --> 00:58:20,440 sure a smattering of other Australian 1367 00:58:27,750 --> 00:58:24,390 skeptics own fans will be there too 1368 00:58:30,210 --> 00:58:27,760 looking forward to it very much I'm 1369 00:58:32,250 --> 00:58:30,220 putting together at the moment er a show 1370 00:58:34,650 --> 00:58:32,260 to play while I'm on my way to town with 1371 00:58:36,840 --> 00:58:34,660 bits and pieces so you don't miss out on 1372 00:58:40,520 --> 00:58:36,850 a skeptic zone while I make the very 1373 00:58:44,850 --> 00:58:40,530 quick trip to Las Vegas and back again 1374 00:58:46,890 --> 00:58:44,860 so thanks again for listening and for 1375 00:58:49,560 --> 00:58:46,900 this week at least this is Richard 1376 00:58:55,770 --> 00:58:49,570 Saunders signing off from Sydney 1377 00:58:57,520 --> 00:58:55,780 Australia you've been listening to the 1378 00:59:02,320 --> 00:58:57,530 skeptic zone 1379 00:59:05,350 --> 00:59:02,330 visit our website at www skeptics on TV